I need some good advice!

[Todd K]

    Early in my career I used only DP on my deer mounts. Thats how I learned, so I used this method for a couple of years than I discovered commercial wet tanning. Once I got used to that method I liked it a little better. Now I out of the 40 heads I do a year, about 75% go to the tannery and I DP the other 25%. (By the way,all LS mammals go to tannery also)
      Here's my problem, Some of my customers have complained about the necks of their mounts, When I skin out the heads I take the meat meas. at the small of the neck then drop down a little to get my second measurement like most catologs say to do for ordering a form. I dont think the measuring is the problem. I sweat the cape overnight then put it on my cape stretcher while I prep the form. By the way, this problem still exists no matter whose form I use. But in my opinion a wet tanned deer always seems to be a little smaller. On the other hand, a DP mount always seems to give you a closer match in size.(On a DP I take a hair on measurement) I've had a couple of customers accuse me of using a different cape because they say the deer they brought me had a bigger neck.
     I lean more to wet tanning because I think the product is a little better, but when people accuse me of giving them a different cape it makes me want to go back to DP only.  Has anyone ever had this problem? They love the mounts, but still make the comments about the size. Does anyone have any suggestions that would help me out, I'm a little discouraged and disgusted right now.

[RoyalOaksTaxidermy]

I have never done work for customers, matter of fact I only just mounted my first squirrel, but I think alot of problems could be solved by measuring the deer in front of the person, and take pictures, then have the person sign the measurment page so they cant say "differetn cape, too small etc" when they pick it up. After all say you have a 6 month turn around. 6 months later that buck has grown in size to a monster in the customers head... Pictures and the measurements being taken in front of them and having them sign it would prove you didnt switch capes or make their monster turn into a regular size buck... Just my thoughts.....

[George Roof]

Todd, as I don't know your tannery, I'd start trying a new one regardless.  I've used East Coast and Carolina when I needed commercials.  Both have exceptional stretch on a wet tanned hide.  (I'm sort of lost with your saying that you "sweat" them.  If they're wet tanned, there no need to sweat.  I simply wash to remove excess oils from the surface and mount.  I get tons of stretch BUT not to the degree that DP allows.  Remember, DP is just a topical treatment. You're still mounting a green hide for all intents and purposes.  If you want a 15 inch neck deer to have a 17 inch neck, DP is the way to go.  

I measure skin on always and I never "drop back" more than 1/4 inch.  I pull the tape tight under the jaw bone up behind the head.  If the butcher leaves me enough neck, I measure 3 inches down, but usually I just add 2 inches to the circumference for that measurement.  For the eye to nose, it's right off the skin.

I suspect your tannery is using  a harsher pickle than necessary and your hides are suffering there. That's exactly why I use JRTS for deer when tanning in shop.  It's really not that much more than DP if you follow the directions and skip the pickle but that strikes a discordant cord with the purists in the industry. I don't care what anyone tells me, a pickle shrinks a hide and unless you have some very good equipment to monitor it, you're "sizes" are going to have to be less.

But that's just MY OPINION and you'll have to decide if it's "good advice" or not.

BTW, I keep a home made "Trophy Data Sheet" on every deer coming into the shop.  I measure it and record all the vitals on a line drawing of a shoulder mount.  If the customer balks, I just hand him the sheet and let him measure the mount versus what his deer measured when it came in.  I've never taken pictures because I have enough to do during deer season without recording that as well.

[Rickey logan]

Most wet tans Easily stretch bigger than they were origionally. Liker George said , use another tannery...............

[Todd K]

     George, I have been using Arlington Cape in Ohio and I know several others who do also. I'm open to try someone different though. When I say sweat the cape, They are damp when I get them back, but I mist the neck and shoulder area with a little water, put them in a plastic bag for about 8 hrs. then mount.  Have you ever been in this predicament before? As far as being accused. I really appriaciate feed back from you guys, thanks.

[Jims Wildlife Studio]

Todd, Your not over soaking your cape's or leaving them wet to long. If that's the case you may be getting an acid swell. I am not familiar with the type of tanning that your tannery uses but this can be your problem. I would also take George's advice and change tanneries. I don't understand what you mean when you say you sweat the capes. Either your working with a wet tanned cape or you are re hydrating a dry tanned cape. Good Luck, Jim

[Todd K]

   I use compressed air to fluff up pretty much everything that I mount and you are right, it does make them look a little bigger. I'm going to try another tannery but I had a bad experience once before. I seen George said Carolina, anyone else use them? I'm open to suggestioins.
Thanks

[Jims Wildlife Studio]

Carolina Fur Dressing, will give you an excellent wet or dry tanned cape. There are many to chose from. East Coast, Wildlife Gallery the list goes on and on. New Method (not my first choice)

[Todd K]

    Thanks for all your imput guys, its means alot to me.
 

[John C]

Todd, put a little  baking soda (sodium bicarb) in a cup maybe two tea spoons and fill the cup with water, stir it up.

Now wet a rag and lightly apply it to the sweat-ed cape. Go slowly and check for stretch, if the cape does not go to the original size ally a 2nd light coat.

.DONT APPLY TO MUCH or the hair could slip

Also check your massage's here on your account for futher info.

[Becky P]

You can stretch a Dped hide 3 inches bigger than it actually was if you wanted to. I now have my hides tanned commercially (I will tan a few with Krowtan if need be and all small lifesize get Krowtanned) and I'm always able to get them stretched back to their orignial size. BTW, I also take meat measurements.
I usually can't measure in front of the customer because most of the deer I get in are frozen.
I do have one pain-in-the-butt customer (need to fire him, LOL), that I showed how I measure. He then proceeded to remeasure his deer three times, each time his deer got bigger. I took the tape away and said "no, like this" and really pulled it up tight (it was over the hide). He didn't like it, but oh well, his deer damn sure wasn't laying on my table growing. LOL

[TrailsEnd]

I used a tannery for years and had the same problem. Not only were the necks shrunk up but there were very baggy faces. I blamed myself. I blamed the forms. I started getting my capes tanned at a different tannery and all of my problems went away.
Chuck

[Hughiam]

I used to use a home pickle of formic acid and Liquid Tan.  I got great stretch, but hated the mess and time it took.  I started tannery shopping by sending a few pieces to several tanneries.  I took good measurements off the animal prior to sending it out.  When I got a batch back in, I compared the green measurements to the tanned measurements.  The tannery that was closest to the green measurment(or over it) is who I went with from then on.

[JL]

Todd, a lot of good advice has been given, but I hope you know that if you want a swelled neck after you mount, you have to purchase a mannikin that has a swelled "rut" neck to begin with. If you dont order one that way, the necks will appear to be thinner even though they measure the same. Also, I use The Wildlife Gallery for my tanning and my deer capes come in wet tanned.I mark them and measure them against my order sheet and usually they are pretty close but I give them the same re-hydrating treatment I give a dry tanned cape and the stretch gets a lot better.Good luck....JL

[Justin]

Why not just use DP and be done with it??