have you tried burning your forms instead of scratching?

[bw]

I know a taxidermist that burns his forms with a torch rather than scratching them with a ruffer or sandblasting.

Have any of you tried that method, and what results have you had.

[cyclone]

You might want to read the material  prefaced by the following:   



"When subjected to burning, polyurethane foam systems will yield toxic fumes consisting of various gases, which may include, but not limited to, carbon monoxide, carbon dioxide and oxides of nitrogen, which may also present a risk to respiratory tract and eyes. Comparison studies of the relative toxicity of materials in fire situations have shown polyurethanes, poly isocyanurates and polystyrene foam to be less toxic than wood in terms of causing death or incapacitation in test animals (See Tables 2 and 3 attached)"

More of which can be found at:

http://www.swdurethane.com/SWDpages/pdfs/burning_schedule.pdf

I hope for his sake that he is doing his burning in a very well ventilated work area or outside and being extremely careful....

[bw]

Yeah,  I probably should have mentioned that he does it outside.  I thought it was a given.  There isnt really anything that I would use a torch to burn inside a building.

[Todd K]

  Thats what I do to those forms that have that nasty outer shell. I do it outside also but cant stand the smell and I wear a good respirator! I think I'm going to buy a sand blaster for future use instead of that method.

[Jims Wildlife Studio]

You'll need a good resperator to Todd. lol

[oldterryr]

burning or lightly torching the skin cahnges the specific gravity of the foam and allows the glue to stick - you are not really melting anything - when screen printing plastic we had to either pass the plastic thru a magnetic field or spot heat it to get ink to stick -

with all this fancy book learning  i sound just like glen conley

[mount it]

------A BETTER WAY-----------------

I use to,but there is a better way. I saw Ben Mears use a roller that has round wheels with points on them to prep his form for mounting. It was at the Southern RTC in March. It is fast and really works great. It punches little holes in the form for the hide paste to stick to but leaves the finish on the form which makes it easyier to slide the skin on. I have had no drumming with this method.He sold them in his catlog or you can get one a lot cheaper at Lowes or Home Depot.It is used by carpet layers to rough the seam on burber or short nap carpet. It will be in the carpet section of the store with the carpet tools. I will get the name of it and post later. Never will I burn forms again. As stated above, the fumes is a killer. Randall   <><

[bw]

Todd K,

Incase you missed my post a couple days ago about the tough skinned forms.....the sandblasting method doesnt work too well on them.  One person replied and said he had no problems with blasting them,  but a couple other guys I know (besides myself) agree that they dont blast worth a crap.

Thats why Im exploring this burning method.

Glad to know you have tried it.

[John C]

Burning also releases a gas of cyanide, cyanide kills red blood cells in just seconds. The cheap res[erators you buy at the local hardware stores will not protect you.

As for sand blasting, if it is not working you are not using the correct sand. Yes it makes a hell of a difference.

I use a white colored quarts sand at 90 psi, quarts  has edges like glass. Again your local hardware store will not have this, you must go to a commercial tool rental store   to find it. They may also haave crushed glass which will work even better.

Wiith either of the tthese it takes only a few minutes.

If the foam is flexible you can coat it with shellac to harden the surface  for ruffing.

[Dean]

Why not use a mannikin prep. I know many hate it and says it doesn't work. It works great if done correctly. I've been using it for 3-4 years and have no drumming. Actually the product I use is the foam board contact adhesive from 3M it's found at building supply stores. I don't know if it is the exact same stuff as mannikin prep. I'm guessing  it may be, but it does work great. The adhesive is designed for the different types of construction foam board. to stick it in place and hold.  At first I always used to wiped the forms down with laquar thinner before spraying them down. I tried it  out a couple times with out wiping them down and saw no difference with  the the way the adhesive stuck. I usually get about 8- 10 wt forms  sprayed out of a can. I've tested it against several different types of hide paste and all worked real well and didn't pull apart after it was set up. Also on drumming if the hide fits correctly. The hide tears before either adhesive lets loose. When I get a shippment of forms in I will spray them down and let them sit at least 12 hours. Then they are ready when I start mounting and don't have to worry about the mess of roughing. I do a final test fit and apply hide paste and put the piece together.  Believe it or not it works and is a lot faster then the mess of roughing up a form burning or sandblasting. I'd say I've done at least 500 deer and game heads this way including  competition pieces.

[George Roof]

Dean, the only reason that manikin prep isn't used more often is because the bond of the skin to the form then becomes no better than the spray adhesive used on the form.  The hide glue will bond easily with the spray glue, but since it's such a thin layer, unless it's dissolved the mold release on the form, the skin can and will drum in those areas.  I think the 3M you use is a much better grade of contact glue and most likely does dissolve the mold release, but some of the cheaper sprays, like Elmer's, etc. just don't give you that trust in holding power.

[Todd K]

 8   Dean, can you find out the exact name of the 3M product you are using? I'm really interested in trying it. Does it work with wet tanned and DP? If it works as well as you say it does, I might not hate using some different forms once in a while!
Thank, Todd

[Dean]

Todd - The name of the 3m spray adhesive is 3M Polystyrene foam Insulation 78 spray adhesive. The other is 3M High strength 90 spray adhesive. I found no difference in results between the two. The high strength 90 also says its for bonding foam. Both come in a black spray cans and can be found at buliding supply stores. I find it at Menards and Home Depot stores, I'm sure most other building supply stores in your area will also carry it too. I still recomend wiping the form down with laquer thinner to remove the mold release that might be on it just for insurance. I've done it without wiping it down a few times and had no problems but would rather play it safe. Most of the time I do use the laquar thinner. It only takes seconds to wipe them down especially in the low spots where drumming can show up. I've never had any adhesion problems or drumming problems when I use the sprays. Elmers or other light duty or general purpose contact sprays won't work. It is to light of a film going on and not enough holding power.

[paul e]

i dont get it guys
it it that bad to grap a stout ruffer or whtever its called
man oh man if it takes 6 or 7 WHOLE BIG MINUTES that would be a lot
this snap together microwave mindset is getting to me

[Dean]

Time is money paul  I'd be scratching for over 10- 12 hours just to prep deer heads each year not to mention all the other game heads and life size. I can prep 10-12 deer forms in 5 minutes by spraying. That would be about a full years worth of prepped forms in an hour.  It's worked for me for 3-4 years. What ever works for you go for it. You can also make your own forms instead of taking that short cut of purchasing them already done. You use the tools of the trade that works for you and what ever saves you time and still get good results.