Rainbow Trout upgrade.... Pictures added! Please comment looking for advice.
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
December 11, 2017, 11:52:38 AM

Login with username, password and session length
Search:     Advanced search
1789328 Posts in 223186 Topics by 49370 Members
Latest Member: Stonefly_norway
* Home Help Search Calendar Login Register
Taxidermy.Net Forum  |  Taxidermy Discussion Categories  |  Fish Taxidermy  |  Topic: Rainbow Trout upgrade.... Pictures added! Please comment looking for advice. « previous next »
Pages: 1 [2] Print
Author Topic: Rainbow Trout upgrade.... Pictures added! Please comment looking for advice.  (Read 1614 times)
Sotired
Silver Member
***
Location: Southern Colorado
Posts: 221


Email
« Reply #15 on: December 05, 2017, 01:24:41 PM »

Just blew this up to help illustrate the head junction.  Should be more gentle.  Trout don't move their heads at the neck like mammals do.  Try for a straight line/gentle slope next time.  Also, as others have pointed out, use reference photos for coloring.  You're on your way with a great start!  Wish I had such great mentors as these guys to help me when I started out!!!


* header-2.jpg (36.36 kB, 500x242 - viewed 182 times.)

* 5.JPG (21.43 kB, 400x295 - viewed 180 times.)
Logged

I'm so tired, I'm re-tired.
Used to think I was invincible, then I ran into Vince!
"It's easier to point a finger than to lend a hand!"
FishArt
Platinum Member
*****
Location: Various Locations
Posts: 9417



WWW Email
« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2017, 02:39:42 PM »

Jim, All good advice here and yes the head juncture is off a bit. IMHO it's your painting that needs the most attention. Look at the two pics that Sotired supplied. Study them carefully. Look for other colors and pay particular attention to hard edges and soft edges. For instance, where the top of the fish color ends at the eye on your paint job vs. the real fish. Notice the harsh jagged line on the real fish vs. the fussy edge of yours. Take an old manilla folder or a piece of cardboard and rip the edge a bit and use it as a blocker below the eye when you hit this color. That is how guys get the harsh jagged line.  Look at your stripe. Notice how on the real fish it starts out skinny/fat/skinny. Angle your airbrush almost parallel to the fish when you start your "pink" stripe and start it on each end (The spray will be finest/pointy from the direction you're spraying so spraying head to tail and tail to head as you get closer to the tail. Move your air brush in a slow stroking motion even before you pull the trigger. This is how you'll get that pointy edge at the start of your pink stripe and the end. Take a close look at the ref pic. In fact you can zoom in on pics a lot to see the colors if you are having a hard time seeing colors. Believe me, there's a lot of reflective colors in "silver" fish and if you're leaving those out you're missing the depth. Continue comparing your fish to the ref pic. Your placement of colors are a tad off typically too. I think it would be wise to break the paper out and start doing some air brushing exercises (typically in your air brush manual) on paper to try to master your air brushing techniques. Lastly, another solid piece of advice I can give you is to NOT rely on the air brush so much. You will have a lot more control with your details if you use colored pencils, shiva sticks, waxes and powders, charcoals - you name it. In fact for many of us as we become well versed with the air brush we discover the more fish we do the less we use the air brush. Not all, but many of us. Ultimately, I think IF you REALLY want to learn - which I think you do, I think you really need to go back to reference and start seeing some of the things I mentioned that I'm not so sure you're seeing. Secondly, I think it would be invaluable for you to take a painting course with Rick Krane or whomever - I also teach. Or buy videos. I'm pretty sure once you see somebody using some of these techniques you'll have a better idea how to implement them.

P.S. Dump the Sharpie too! Try using a water color pencil and dip the tip in water to create your spots if you want more control. It's fast and gives the right edge to the spots. That's all I'm giving up! For any more you gotta take the course!
Logged

"FishArt"
Marty Shimkus
Fish Specialties Taxidermy LLC
Various Locations
www.FishSpecialties.NET
Sotired
Silver Member
***
Location: Southern Colorado
Posts: 221


Email
« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2017, 08:04:40 PM »

Good advice Marty, especially with the watercolor pencils!!!  I find they give the most realistic spots, when done right.  And Jim, don't rely on just black for spots!!!  Try all kinds of dark colors.  I found dark grays, like Paynes gray looked better on most Rainbows, some need a dark green or brown.  Experimenting is the name of the game!  Found some pics trying to show some iridescence.  Had to shrink them to fit on here, so they lost some!  But you should get some idea.

One other thing, don't ever assume that all spots are round!!!  Look at the reference pics!

~S


* yellow-dog-flyfishing-adventures-russia-rainbow-trout-flyfishing-the-best-of-kamchatka-ozernaya-1.jpg (54.99 kB, 600x399 - viewed 162 times.)

* pautzke-030716.png (105.83 kB, 385x154 - viewed 163 times.)
Logged

I'm so tired, I'm re-tired.
Used to think I was invincible, then I ran into Vince!
"It's easier to point a finger than to lend a hand!"
FishArt
Platinum Member
*****
Location: Various Locations
Posts: 9417



WWW Email
« Reply #18 on: December 06, 2017, 08:57:43 AM »

Thanks Sotired! Great advice as well on the color differences. Also, love the eye tilts on those reference pics!
Logged

"FishArt"
Marty Shimkus
Fish Specialties Taxidermy LLC
Various Locations
www.FishSpecialties.NET
Sotired
Silver Member
***
Location: Southern Colorado
Posts: 221


Email
« Reply #19 on: December 06, 2017, 09:08:24 AM »

Thanks Marty, I had to shrink them to get the site to accept the size, I am disappointed in the second one.  It clearly showed blue,violet, rose, turquoise, gold, and orange reflectance!  I try to save all the useful photos I can. 

~S
Logged

I'm so tired, I'm re-tired.
Used to think I was invincible, then I ran into Vince!
"It's easier to point a finger than to lend a hand!"
Pikeonthefly
Bronze Member
**
Posts: 67


Email
« Reply #20 on: December 07, 2017, 12:10:24 AM »

I too have been working on a Brown Trout upgrade for 2 years. Its been wiped down over 30 times last year and 6 this year. I gave up on it one day but it reeled me back in the next. Its almost complete and I will post it for critique when its finished. If it wasn't for Rick Krane/Frank Koutla and the other champions who offered their advice it would never have been possible. So I wanted to share this with you. Not sure what the pro's and cons might be over the long run but for the immediate time it may help you. I paint the belly first. Then spray a quick coat of Wet Look Gloss over it and let it dry. Then I apply the next colors and for this brown I used red/yellow and orange colored pencils. I just scribbled the lower side of the body into the white and wet it down and blended it together with my fingers. It worked quite well. Then I sealed over the colors with the Wet Look Gloss. Then I applied the top etc. and again sealed it. Here's where the sealing between coats pays off. If your not happy with the next color as in its too heavy or the wrong color/colors take a paper towel and rubbing alcohol and wipe it off. The previous colors will not be affected. When I went to apply the spots I had to make some of them up as I went along. At first I had too many. So I wiped them off. Then they were too close and too big. Wipe them off. Once I had them just right they were hit with the gloss. Now its time for the powders. Put some on and seal it. If you just paint the whole fish and then hit it with the gloss sometimes it can be ruined because some of the colors will bleed into each other and create an effect you don't want and if you don't like one of the colors you have to wipe the whole thing down and start over. Been there. Done that and I am done with that. Take a pike for example. If you paint the side green and then hit the spots they are going to turn greenish white. Paint your base color and seal it then hit the spots with the white. Just make sure you flash in between colors so it doesn't build up and become plastic in the end and make sure to wipe all the alcohol off or it will leave a white film. Look at it as a second chance method. Take it one step at a time. Purchase a Rick Krane video and apply his technique one step at a time. You will be glad you did. Good luck!
Logged
Sotired
Silver Member
***
Location: Southern Colorado
Posts: 221


Email
« Reply #21 on: December 07, 2017, 07:20:33 PM »

I know, I just can't leave this alone!  Found some reference for the red stripe showing where it begins and ends better, also how it's about 1/3 above, and 2/3 below the lateral line.

~S


* 239186.jpg (87.06 kB, 550x302 - viewed 96 times.)

* Onmyk_f0.jpg (91.08 kB, 600x378 - viewed 97 times.)
Logged

I'm so tired, I'm re-tired.
Used to think I was invincible, then I ran into Vince!
"It's easier to point a finger than to lend a hand!"
Jim Ardle
Silver Member
***
Location: Saylorsburg, Pennsylvania
Posts: 222



WWW Email
« Reply #22 on: December 07, 2017, 07:50:58 PM »

Thank you guys for all the input and advice. All prime examples of why I enjoy this site, i did use my GI bill to attend a 3 month taxidermy school. We mounted 6 fish of various species, at which point we were taught to paint all fish using 8 colors. Needless to say I feel like I didn't learn a thing. I am now saving to attend a Rick Krane workshop.
Logged

Jim Ardle
Wildlife Recreations Taxidermy
205 Majestic Drive
Saylorsburg, PA 18353
(610) 597-0099
Ken's Fish
Silver Member
***
Location: Illinois
Posts: 207



WWW Email
« Reply #23 on: December 07, 2017, 11:03:07 PM »

Jim,

You received tons of great advice, absorb as much of it as you can. It takes courage to come on here, post photos and ask for constructive criticism. And you have taken it all exceptionally well. Kudos to you!

I happen to agree with Dondi 100% first and foremost. You can have the most fantastic paint work and if the anatomy isn't correct it all goes for not...IMO.

I'm only going to talk about the head/body junction. As many have already said that you need that nice even flow from the head to the body. But I think I can see why it fits the way it does. Not to worry though because it's a common mistake among beginner taxidermists.

Take a look at your 3rd photo, the one with the original head and fins removed. The throat latch area from the pectoral fin forward extends fairly straight forward. Although it appears you purchased the correct size head, it looks as if you fit the head to match that lower profile, throat latch area. Which would throw off that upper head/body profile. When pre-fitting the head make sure the upper profile is correct, first and foremost and make note what needs to be done with lower profile. It's much easier to alter the lower profile by either cutting away the material or adding too it. Sometimes maybe a little of both.

In this case the lower profile needed to be trimmed back so the throat latch area fits the head with a nice flow to it as well. Yes you will be cutting back into the skin and the body but shouldn't have to go back no further than the pectoral fin. Then when the head is properly fitted but before you permanently attach it, you can finish off that area of the fish. Yes there is a little bit of work there but you will have a nice transition from head to body on both the upper and lower profiles.

BTW...don't feel like you didn't learn a thing from previous classes. Yes some are better than others but they are all stepping stones to your ultimate goal. Saving up for one of Rick's classes will not only be an eye opener, but a well educated investment as well. Good luck!

Ken
Logged

Jim Ardle
Silver Member
***
Location: Saylorsburg, Pennsylvania
Posts: 222



WWW Email
« Reply #24 on: December 08, 2017, 11:29:38 PM »

Ken,

Thanks for the insight, Its not that I think my previous schooling was of no use...as I did learn some really basic techniques. But I didn't learn half of what I expected to learn. The sad part is I went to a school founded and taught by very reputable Taxidermist, who is credited with founding the Pennsylvania Taxidermy Association. When it came to fish, I expected to learn how to thin paints, scale tip, antique etc. Basically all I learned was how to carve fish bodies, dump paint from the bottle into the airbrush and card fins. Never even learned how to repair split fins. I feel like I spend more time searching and buying videos to learn from than I did at a 3 month school. I have talked to other vets, who have attended this same school and our consensus was the same.
Logged

Jim Ardle
Wildlife Recreations Taxidermy
205 Majestic Drive
Saylorsburg, PA 18353
(610) 597-0099
Sotired
Silver Member
***
Location: Southern Colorado
Posts: 221


Email
« Reply #25 on: December 09, 2017, 01:46:38 PM »

You know Jim, we all get our start somewhere!  A lot of us more mature guys (ahem) like myself got started with a correspondence course from the Northwestern School of Taxidermy in Nebraska.  Monthly classes included such "timely" courses as "making money doing birds for womens hats"(???) and creating stuffed frog orchestras!  Also were how to mount deer heads, by building a mannikin froma skull, some boards, and a lot of excelsior and clay!  Little did we know that these were written in the '20s and never updated, except to change arsenic solutions to borax.

The fish section never mentioned anything about removing the skull bones, and I don't think it said anything much about carding fins.  Painting was to be done with oil paints thinned with turpentine!  My first fish, stuffed with mache of course, looked more like a car wreck than a bluegill!!!

Mentors?  there were no mentors unless you were lucky!  Nobody had time for kids.  I was lucky enough to see Henry Inchamuck (Wichers) at the Denver Museum, but he didn't have a lot of time for a kid.  Finally, I got on at Jonas Brothers when Denny Behn was managing the taxi dept.  Thats where I learned A LOT from Tony Canova who did fish there.  That experience led me to doing a LOT of experimenting on my own!  That is where you really learn!!!

Don't EVER be afraid to think outside of the box and try something radical.  It's only paint, and paint can be wiped off and painted over!  Without mistakes you never learn and the only people that never make mistakes are the ones that never try!   ;)

~S
Logged

I'm so tired, I'm re-tired.
Used to think I was invincible, then I ran into Vince!
"It's easier to point a finger than to lend a hand!"
Pages: 1 [2] Print 
Taxidermy.Net Forum  |  Taxidermy Discussion Categories  |  Fish Taxidermy  |  Topic: Rainbow Trout upgrade.... Pictures added! Please comment looking for advice. « previous next »
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP
Contents © 2006-2017 Taxidermy.Net, LLC. All rights reserved. © 2017 Carbon Media Group Outdoors. Privacy Policy.
Powered by SMF 2.0.9 | SMF © 2011, Simple Machines
| TOS | Privacy
Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.063 seconds with 34 queries.