IM sorry this got so lenghtly. I am refering to a thread left recently about hunting waterfowl. I can see where you are comming from but I dont think that you spend enough time in the flyway to fully understand this. I live on a farm in north central ND right in the flyway, until the last 4-5 years we had tremendous hunting within a mile from the house. Last year on the first weekend of NR season I drove to town 6 miles road which you will never see another vehicle on 90% of the time, 6 miles 1 day last year 13 NR rigs. 1st week we had some awsome shoots, by sunday after they opened the gates you couldnt find a bird in the country. Virtually none of the people know anything about hunting birds, they come in w/ their damn boats hit every pothole and slough in the country. Anything that they dont put boats on they jump shoot. When you shoot birds off the water they DONT come back and alot of them will fly even hundreds of miles before roosting again. After this our hunting is done its done for everybody, wouldnt you like to come hunt maybe every third year and have good shoots instead of coming here and getting NOTHING otherwise. In Devils Lake last fall there was no way you could get a room in town for opening weekend from July on. After they were here the first week they empty no birds left most of the guys went home or went somewhere else to blow them out. There are so much politics weighing into this right now its crazy but it pretty much all boils down to less marketing and alot more managing. Dont get me wrong I hunt MN MT MB SK SD TX and I am alien there and I am welcomed and I appreciate this but I we dont change our ways w/ mg. birds It will continue to get worse. Heres where the twist comes in this for me, I am also a guide we run 40-60 hunters per year although this is in a different location (right on can. border). We have NO leased land neither do any of the other guides in the area. There is only 1 waterfowl outfitter that I know of in nothern ND he is out od Devils Lake. The reason so much land is becoming unavailable is there are alot of people who have absolutly no respect for anyone here or their property these guys are so hard up shoot a duck that it is rediculous. Our private land that is posted is not posted for $, where we guide we do not hunt any field posted or not w/o talking to land owner, these arent people that we know either, we tell them we are guiding and hunting in fields over decoys noone has every asked for $ although when we are done hunting for the year I have a list of every persons land that we hunted on for the year and I bring each one of the a turkey or a ham its a shoe in for next time there are birds around there next year. There is alot of license plate lookin going at these times because it only takes 1 bad apple to ruin the barrel.
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I must admit that I see the same problems here in Southern MN. Allot of the guys from the cities who make the big bucks like to come down to this area. They beg, move in on other hunters, and offer to pay unbeleivable prices for a chunk of land and make it tough for the locals to hunt. They dont respect anything, they shoot anything and everything, and it gives us all a bad name. I cant even get a field anymore for the early canada goose season unless I want to pay, and I really cant afford that. I cant tell you how many times I have been turned down because the last guys that hunted the land did something that upset the land owner. As far as the ND - MN laws are concerned I really thing that ND should stand thier ground, but MN should also impose the same rules to NR hunters. One of the big probelms is that ND and SD are very easy when it comes to laws. MN on the other hand is one of those states that regulates everything. Other then having more game in ND that is one of the reasons that many hunters go to ND and SD.
After 20 years of guide'n I would agree with ya'll bout its hard to get property..I just moved out of the bigstone area .. The locals wanted to much for a lease..I just moved to public areas .I myself will be finally going out of state this year to hunt ..Only because of invites,otherwise I have never had a problem getting birds in MN..Usually the clowns that dont get thier bird use 3 words in setting up or calling "thats good enough" use those words in effort and you might as well take up golf in the fall....
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I surely hope you guys aint one of those cry babies snivlen about the kids day..Id say getused to the way things are its only going to get worse with the advancment of gear and abilities ....BUT as a taxidermist if you are one then be greatfull they are crushing birds it only means more work...
why do you need different bird management. Sounds like you guys want to manage the "people" differently. Guess what---as long as ND promotes hunting,lots of birds,ect. you'll be dealing with lots of travelers. The motels,stores,ect. like the money and the guides like the money. The hunters like to shoot so thats what they will do. Its not like ND holds the birds all winter long so I don't get "more intense " bird management or restricting hunters from MN and all that other stuff. Migratory birds are not "owned" by ND or by MN. They belong to "everyone" and like it or not the slob down the street that buys a duck stamp has just as much of a right to throw steel at them as you do.
The more hunters we have here the fewer birds everybody kills. The snows bunch up 15-20 thous. and there is nothing you can do w/ them unless your one of the ditch [expletive deleted]s who chase flocks all day ever southward cause you cant stand not killing something. Ducks all get chased out like I said in devils lake last fall all the hunyuckers pulled out no birds here you didnt make a penny off these guys just the same as I didnt make a penny off the locals. Like I said I would rather mount a average number of waterfowl each year as you would if things were better goverened, as compared to now. You are definatly right about one thing it is only going to get worse, if we do not try to come up w/ some reasonable compramises. One of you guys said that you hunt SD, I not sure correct me if I am wrong but dont they limit NR waterfowl hunting licenses sales to around 12,000, same birds going through there that fly directly over my house. I hope I havent offened anybody too badly but this is something that really concerns me.
Thank you
I understand your concern.I also understand that you want to make money off of people coming to ND to hunt---no problem. However you cannot legislate good behavior which is what ND is attempting to do. Don't think that putting "caps" on liscences or making people hire guides or whatever will solve those problems. Oftentimes when people have to pay "more" money to participate in an activity, "hunting", it brings out the worst in them as they feel that they are " entitled" to certain results.Unfortunately I feel that many "guides" are part of the problem as they also do not stay within the bounds of the law and in turn cast an unfavorable light on "all" guides. It seems that you follow the birds south? Have you ever tried to get onto private property in TX to goose hunt? Not like ND is it? When everyone tries to get a big slice of the money pie wildlife pays the price.
I don't quite follow your 1st post with concerns towards me. Sounds like we have the same concerns...I do live the flyway and have lived here all my life. I know things are getting tight out there! That's why I hunt on the outskirts of the problem areas and do not have as much of a problem with pressure or land access. My only point is from a TAXIDERMY STAND POINT,...Which this is a bird taxidermy forum. Lack of land access is what causes people to stop hunting...I don't know about you, but the majority of hunters who bring birds TO ME are not rich millionaires...If they were, why are we charging so little for our product...The majority of customers are everyday people who don't have a lot of money to spend on taxidermy...If people stop hunting(the everyday joe) it will hurt us. Wally's comment on more work for us with guides is ludicris! And it's easy for him to say that, when he is a guide and lives in a state that is already ruined beoynd repair for hunting. I'm just a kid myself and the only reason I live in this state is for the hunting & fishing opportunities, otherwise I would have moved a long time ago and be making much more money elsewhere! Sorry, Wally it's not to late for us...We can fix the problem and lot's of us will fight for it...I don't have all the answers except...Lack of land access will stop people from hunting and then it will go all to hell...
...If your a taxidermist when people collect trophys its work'n time ..I moved out of the best waterfowling in the state and ya know what I still get birds,I study areas, take the time to find where they are and go further back in the lakes than others...,As for being a guide yep done it did it.. I couldnt always get the easy to shoot feed feilds ,,which you will find are usually what the weak caller/decoyers have to have...
Every year I hear how bad things are and ya know what I STILL KNOCK ON DOORS AND GET IN.Tossed many hay bales,brought the landowners smoked fish,beer,drove tractors,insulated house's,,sent many Xmas cards....
We killed 875 honkers the last year I guided..As for guide's wreck'n things..Its actually the clowns who go out thinking they bought all this gear and why aint it working.Ive seen many locals shoot from a truck window... DT I just read my post I said nothing like what ya got posted.. What I ment was if those outa staters and other are crushing birds it's work for us. I think you will find yes its nice to give things but a landowner would rather have ya help than take the easy route..How many times ya help milk cows or load pigs?I used to raise xtra broilers just so I could offer a good chicken dinner to em
As for Mn being wrecked OMG you really must be weak in the feild,,This is still one of the best states in the union to enjoy waterfowling...Maybe I should send you a link to a map I will be putting on the net soon so you can find a spot,I am passing all my west metro,bigstone and LQP spots off to my Clients and friends ..Guess what the few landowner's asked of me when I didnt renew a lease with them?/ They asked me to find people for em because they dont like listening to all the crap every fall from the rich boys in the fancy trucks wanting to hunt for free...
Otherwise do like the rest of us do and spend time scouting,judgeing by your post you must not be doing somthing right..It might be too late for ya!LOL The time it takes to write this crap you could be calling the landowner and seeing if theres anything you do FOR THEM.....
I am a land owner I have 3260 acres of farm land in central ND this afternoon one of my fields 1/4 mile w of house had 10-20 thousand snows feeding on it. In the past eight years I have never seen a goose sit on that field in the fall, before that I had many spectacular shoots over that field almost every year. I realize that that probably dosent mean a whole lot, but I am trying to get at is I dont know what the right answers are be it limiting licenses, issueing lotteries or something else just so that we can maintain a quality hunt for everybody. If the bird hunting is so good in MN why are they all over here. We are issuing way more NR licenses than resident which is fine as long as we maintain the quality of our bird hunting. The birds do belong to everyone but if you were seeing what you have in MN continually being destroyed by NR hunters you would howl also. I do guide NR hunters but I honestly dont belive that we are doing any damage because of the way we hunt. NEVER over water always in field where they have fed the night before. Last year I hunted 1 barley field for 8 day straight, we shot limits every day. We didnt hunt it in the evening while scouting every night it would be full of ducks again. They will not leave or bunch up w/o the constant pressure from road hunters and guys trying to sneak. I honestly belive that we could solve our entire problem by making it only legal to hunt over decoys in fields. As for taxi's gettin more work your crazy, dang hard to mount birds that aint been shot yet.
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I am a land owner I have 3260 acres of farm land in central ND this afternoon one of my fields 1/4 mile w of house had 10-20 thousand snows feeding on it. In the past eight years I have never seen a goose sit on that field in the fall, before that I had many spectacular shoots over that field almost every year. I realize that that probably dosent mean a whole lot, but I am trying to get at is I dont know what the right answers are be it limiting licenses, issueing lotteries or something else just so that we can maintain a quality hunt for everybody. If the bird hunting is so good in MN why are they all over here. We are issuing way more NR licenses than resident which is fine as long as we maintain the quality of our bird hunting. The birds do belong to everyone but if you were seeing what you have in MN continually being destroyed by NR hunters you would howl also. I do guide NR hunters but I honestly dont belive that we are doing any damage because of the way we hunt. NEVER over water always in field where they have fed the night before. Last year I hunted 1 barley field for 8 day straight, we shot limits every day. We didnt hunt it in the evening while scouting every night it would be full of ducks again. They will not leave or bunch up w/o the constant pressure from road hunters and guys trying to sneak. I honestly belive that we could solve our entire problem by making it only legal to hunt over decoys in fields. As for taxi's gettin more work your crazy, dang hard to mount birds that aint been shot yet.
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that you would have a difficult time convincing any thinking person that we should only be able to hunt ducks or geese over land. Guess you have never done any diver hunting?
Ok Your right yes they birds wont move..But I sit next to feed feilds and pull my limit no problem.. If your state had any control they would set up sanctuarys and get the birds to stay.The bigstone LQP line is a prime example..Match up the amount of birds you have and the total water that is protected..That might help ya think?.As for your thought on decoying on water ,LOL thanks I needed a laugh!.
Taxidermy gee I have several ND birds in my freezer from cleints here's the kicker about a third are ND res..Hummmmmmmmmm
As for bird migration obvioulsy you dont take in cosideration of snow belt and wind control.Snowgeese were a good test know one know when and where ..Useing the radio colloars was a huge helpo in figurein out what they do when the flight path is matched up to a weather report and snow belt
Mn has killer waterfowl hunting for those that KNOW HOW ..I have only gone outa this state to crush a few snows, otherwise I have seen absolutly no reason to travel..However many gunners like to hunt different areas because of the change...You have to take in account the majority of the gunners that travel most <not all are weekend hopefulls but those that are wait all year to get a chance to go..They listen to your state's bird reports and beleive all is welcome..Mn gunners over there Humm I would say talk to your area chamber of commerce and tell them not to have Tony Dean advertise...Commerce, gee who supports them if its not the ice fisherman and hunters?ND and SD aint the largest in tax collection are they..Other wise you would see better development on the road and towns..
Yep we stopped the destruction of wetlands Humm who was doing it the landowers that buy up and drain all and turn it into a tax cut..
My question to you is what have you dont to increase the sanctuary on your 3260 acre's? Dug any ponds, pumped water or donated section to the feds for development?
Every year I see soo many outa staters fishing and deer hunting here,But ya know I still aint been blame'n others..I just dig into the bag of tricks and figure a better way that the other guys..A GOOD waterfowler will...
As for sneak ups and window shooters..Live'n and gunn'n on the boared of SD I had sooo many do that to me..So I learned to hunt the center feild and park trucks in the obvious spots..I used to think the birds would flare NOT.. Its the lame calling and crappy decoy placement,poorly hidden gunners that scare's birds.Ever noticed the birds dont flare to far off from work trucks?.
If your not getting work in your shop maybe ya might consider that this attitude you have is carrying out to the public?Do you make staments like this in public? If so ya think anyone is traveling out there would drop a bird off? Maybe why I have a increase in mounts? I wouldn't blame anyone for my not getting game only my own inabilities'......I have several ND res that are guides and ya know I sure apreciate them giveing our shop refferals..Sure is nice haveing birds shipped to the door.Just finished a doz ND roosters 3 I have to shipp back there... Id bet your the kinda guy that snarl's at the NR's when your in town? Ya think the People who are counting on the traveler will give you a refference?