I'm fairly new to this forum, but not to Taxidermy...I've just noticed that everybody hear is very cautious to give information on paint schedules for bills/legs...etc...The most common response is check the Breakthrough manual...As if we are costing them money for sharing this information for free...Which maybe we are...But then wouldn't it be true that any information shared is probably in some manual written by somebody...Costing them money by us sharing it for free...Just wondering why it's a "no, no" on that subject...Not trying to ruffle any feathers!
Return to Bird Taxidermy Category Menu
because it's easier to see it in pictures than it is to try to explain it in words. BP
A lot of artists on this forum are top notch taxis who spent numerous hours devising their own schedules through time and trial and error. Whu should they give them up for free?
in the B-through Waterfowl Finishing Manual. That's a lot of info to type out. They recommend 9 different colors.
.....WASCO, the host of this site, sells that kind of thing. it's just professional courtesy when we don't give away their product(for lack of a better term)to anyone who wants it. Yes, it's copywrite material that most of us bought. Why should we be expected to "give" it to you, just because you want it.
There's lots of good FREE advice given here, appreciate it. Then buy the manuals with the stuff you need from WASCO so the rest of the advice can remain free. While your at it, thank Ken for this site.
Even when someone writes it down from memory using the name brand colors, it could be considered infringement. If I have a personal schedule, I don't mind sharing, but most of them are taken verbatim out of the Breakthrough Manual. Why don't you buy one and then you won't have to worry about where to find it. The Breakthrough manuals are by world class taxidermists, so you know they're right.
Most painting schedules are much more than a simple list of colors. A list of colors will not, by itself, help you paint a bill or foot. You need to know where to put the colors,in what order, and how much to get a decent result. Such an explanation is difficult on this forum and would not help you very much. The text material provides diagrams, recommends blends and defines amounts to get a result. For me, I do not ever follow a paint schedule exactly - no two birds are the same color and seem to always require some adjustment in hue and intensity. Good Luck
Stop and take a look at Ricks website!1
Submitted by Rick A. on 2/23/05 at 7:03 PM. ( rickacker@roughridergamebirds.com ) 207.230.140.240
www.roughridergamebirds.com
Something is fishy here! Rick if you have the expereince you claim, why would you be bitching about paint schedules?
If you are smart enough to have a shop you are smart enough to read the first few pages of all the Breakthrough manuals.
If you have the experience why would you worry about anyones elses paint schedule.
I had a good quailty taxidermist once tell me a olive bill on a male fall mallard could not be Olive green!
I am not color blind, but most certyainly are not Wendy's cup yellow, but every bird from his shop is yellow, bright yellow.
I disagree, so would you possibly with my paint schedule.
I could say Yellow ochre is close enough and be done with it and for many Male Mallard bills that and a bit of black is all thats needed.
Kids, grownups and anyone else who wants a paint schedule buy the fricken book, it gives you everything you need without the anxiouty of why someone will not answer your questions.
People like you Rick are why many questions dont het answered these days.
People like me...I was just asking a question, not bitching, complaining or anthing of the sort. Just wodering what the protocal was! Is it a crime to ask a question? I wasn't being disrespectful to anyone or this forum...John C, maybe you should learn to read before you attack someone! I'm usually the one lending a helping hand to people who have paint schedule questions...I just wanted to know if this was taboo...WOW, some of you people are unreal...
Especially where it come to the Breakthrough Manuals. They're for sale to everyone to buy. So buy them. They're not all that expensive. And most of the schedules are a little lengthy to post anyways. And I don't think it's right or legal for us to give someone a schedule that we paid for. A lot of taxidermist have spent endless hours and years practicing the art of reproducing that color that they see. Most of us didn't have the luxury of the computer and the help people have now. I myself can't tell you how many hours and money I've spent in schools or with people teaching me the how to do what I do now. All I can really say to the people asking these questions or asking for schedules is. Go out and take a art class at one of the many schools that are out there or go to a community colleges. This isn't something you'll learn tonight, or next week.
I don't think most of the people asking these question even realize what it takes to produce or make a schedule. Or even understand the correct techinque's to do after they have one. If they would just learn to tone, blend, do washes, even learn how to correctly mix colors. They would have half the battle won. Sorry, I know this may sound harsh to some... But some of the people here really need to step back and just be thankful, not only for this forum we have here. And the people that give out information day in and day out. I think a lot of them need to start putting a little more incentive and initiative in their life. Not everything is going to be handed to them on a silver platter. Some things are just going to have to be learned the hard way.
Coyote
I for one like to come in here and answer certain questions, yet skip others, because I feel like it. Im sure you know how that is, too. I also get paid for this stuff elsewhere, but dont mind doing it here (even though I get my butt reamed from some idiot now and then in here, lol). But, simply put, maybe the paint schedules arent often offered up for the simpliest of reasons...we dont have them! Im always asked about the nose and eyes of deer, for example. Sometimes others answer that query with a lead to an article I did. yet I dont offer. Know why? Its always changing, just like when someone recently phoned me about coloring antlers. I couldnt really answer him, because I keep changing the answer! So, quite possibly its little more then just that. So Rick, thats MY answer to it, anyway!
I was not asking for paint schedules from anybody?! Where are you people getting this crap? I've somtimes given out my own schedules for people when asked on this forum! I do not own the Breakthrough paint schedule manual...I'm sure it's great, but I have developed my own methods over the years and that is the information I have shared with people on this forum. That is not copyright infringment...Give me a break! I was just trying to be helpful. I repeat, I wanted to find out why other people rarely give out that information...Now, I know. I still don't see the difference between sharing personal paint schedules compared to... "how to properly wire a flying mount," or "how make artifical water," which are both in Breakthrough manuals that I do own. People give out information that they have learned from the other manuals all the time so whats the difference?. And for the record...Just because you help somebody out with your own personal paint schedule, doesn't mean they can pull it off...It takes years of trial and error. Hell, I can't pull of my own sometimes. Sorry, to affend a few of you, but you really should read things a little closer and not be so quick to attack somebody who was only offering people a little help! I will refrain from giving tips on my OWN paint schedules from now on!
I hope MY answer didnt get you to post that last one. I was simply saying I think the paint schedules we use change so much, maybe thats why some of us dont post any. I KNOW thats why I dont. Just do your thing, its all just opinion in here anyway.
The way I paint a pheasant beak changes daily...I just think this whole thing is ridiculous. I had no idea how quick people are to trash someone for asking a question on this site. I was refreshed to see how people are so helpful on this site normally! For John C to make statements like that about me over my orginal post just blows my mind. I'm just somebody who learning like everybody else and trying to imporve on each bird I do. I've got a long way to go, but thankfully there have been people who have been nice enough to take me under their wing and show me a thing or too. I thought this was a place I could do that too! Maybe I'm still upset about loosing Randy Moss today...It's tough to be a Vikings fan!
I just did. TWICE. And both times it comes out the same way. I'm sorry, but you stammering and stuttering doesn't change what you said. Let me copy and paste it so you don't have to scroll up.
"I've just noticed that everybody hear is very cautious to give information on paint schedules for bills/legs...etc...The most common response is check the Breakthrough manual...As if we are costing them money for sharing this information for free...Which maybe we are...But then wouldn't it be true that any information shared is probably in some manual written by somebody...Costing them money by us sharing it for free"
"AS IF WE ARE COSTING THEM MONEY FOR SHARING THIS INFORMATION FOR FREE" Now what part of that doesn't look like encouraging copyright infringement?
...now I'm talking fish here, not bills. Anyway, you state yourself that it sometimes" takes years of trial and error to develop".
Personally, I don't do paint schedules for fish because they can be SO different. Manytimes I'll give out bits and pieces of information of how I achieve a certain effect. But my philosophy parallels your above quote. I believe newcomers SHOULD get some sweat equity under their belts and create their own. In my opinion this is BETTER for them in the long run - they'll develop their own style. If somebody wants to know how I paint my fish they can take a course with me and learn. I'm not giving them out for free...
.......THIS TIME, Rick! You said you haven't been coming to this site for very long, so maybe you should be cut a little slack. People come here ALL the time wanting freebees, like paint schedules. Like George said, most of them aren't ours to "give". Or they are our own schedules that change, or are hard to explain. The people who ask for them would only benefit if they bought the reference suggested. And some of the requests are just plain stupid. Would you need to ask for a paint schedule for a Canada Goose? It has been asked for on MORE than one occasion. Go back through the archives and check it out.
And I also feel guilty that I don't buy more from WASCO, but like you, I'm a long way and shipping will add up in a hurry. I do try to make up for it by buying a lot from them at World. Ken has done a great service to our industry by maintaining this site, so I figure I should try to promote his products when I can. And that includes criticizing when someone appears to want something for nothing!
I was asking if it would be a big deal, if I were to give my OWN paint schedules to people asking on this site...I was just trying to find out what the guide lines are...That's all...I was also making a point, that it seems like lot's of other information is shared on this site that would be found in Breakthrough manuals that I do own! I'm sure I could hit the orange button and find a few instances of that! I was neither "Criticizing or asking for something for nothing!" George, I'm not some newbie that you can talk down to! I was just asking a valid question? I am neither stammering nor stuttering!
Try living the life of a BROWN'S fan
.......It wasn't until your THIRD posting on this thread that you mentioned "your own paint schedules". Although you don't state it as such, your first two imply that Breakthrough schedules could be freely given out. That's what got the responses you were given. If you want to give out your schedules, that's fine with me.
I never implyied anthing of the sort. "Freely given"? When I said paint schedules, I meant your OWN! Which I have clearly said several times since! I guess, I figured that would be obvious! Apparently not, my bad! I'm not some begininer looking for a free ride! Thank you for giving me a break "THIS TIME" old fart and making me feel so welcome. I would discuss this with you in email form, and not waste the time of people on this forum, if you would have left a valid email address!
I also asked for help with a Mallard bill and feet the other day but I certainly wasn't trying to avoid "paying" for information that you guys have had to pay for.
I certainly get a lot of good "free" information and advice from all of you and I really appreciate it but I certainly don't mind paying for the advice either. I'm brand new at this and this site so I'm just looking for direction! Thanks for the information on where to get the paint schedules.....I didn't know where to get that information before now. Thanks again for all you guys and your help!
.....What you implied in your original post. You made absolutely no mention of giving away your own schedules. Go back and READ your posting and those that follow. It is pretty obvious that I'm not the only one that read it that way. You may not have intended it that way, but that is EXACTLY what it says.
Nor did I make any mention that people should give the paint schedule from Breakthrough out...I said, "The most common response is to check the Breakthrough manual"...Does that in anyway imply people should give it out? In my book NO! I simply made the comparison of giving out info in other Breakthrough manuals compared to the paint schedule manual and what is the difference really?! You can take that anyway you want, but I have clearly stated...I just wanted to find out if it was a big deal for ME, to point a newbie in the right direction with MY paint schedules. I've also received 2 apologies from people on this forum for jumpin my sh*t on this subject! Once again, thanks for making me feel welcome and your user name fits you well!