Why do people Dry Preserve skins?

Submitted by Leroy P. on 3/29/01. ( mtnman1020@cs.com ) 64.12.96.108

Why do people use it? Is it not a very risky deal,on a customers hide?Would not the work put out be of a very low quaility?How does the hair keep from slipping?Squirrels and birds i can see the call for its use,but a trophy antlered specimen wood be scary,to me?
I'm not degradeing anyone but would like to know why it would be used?
It seems to me,from how i see it is applied,on the inside of the skin only[?],and the slippage is on the hair side,how does it prevent it?What happens to a DP skin with humidity changes?
I guess i'm a coward to try it!

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IT'S FOOLPROOF !

This response submitted by Matt on 3/29/01. ( mbchoate@twlakes.net ) 207.144.243.157

It is a good way to preserve skns for mounting . It can give just as good a results as a tanned skin if done properly...Take it from me....I have mounted several thousand gameheads and even won an award or 2 and ALL were done using Bess MAid Preservative...They look just as good now as they did 10-15 years ago ..Nuff said


Its fast and easy/

This response submitted by John C on 3/29/01. ( ) 208.44.115.49

Sure there are a few people that like it, esp. in the south. Tanning takes more time and knowledge. The only half way decent mounts I have seen done with it are in MR. Sam Touchstone museum, but it is climate control.

When fleshing I rub DP on so I can flesh the raw hide. The salt and tan. Even with the new EPOXIES I still dont think their longevity is going to mater.

About 12 years ago, I had a headmounted by a very good taxidermist with dp, he used dp all the time, still does. thats heads is now a pience of crap, because of cracking, it has never be climate control.

Dp is for fleshing and the birds, esp. now that tanning methods are easy and produce a longer lasting mount. I also dont think Spray Tan will produce a long lasting mount, but we will have to wait and see.

Can you trust a hide that has Blood locked in, bacteria dried in it, or a possible deadly but dormant virus in it.

I think when you explain this to a customer they will opt for a tanned hide.

Taxidemist are our own worst enemies, many get so scared to raise their price to cover tanning and the extra time. Its a proven fact that sending hide out fo tanning will save time and cost and produce a better last mount.


It's Cheap

This response submitted by Old Fart on 3/29/01. ( ) 208.230.170.51

It works great on small animals and birds but if you live where there are
humid summers and dry cold winters I wouldn't use it on deer heads. This
has been covered before, dry preserve is mostly talc(talcum powder). It
is a drying agent, other things are added to bug proof it. Maybe some ot
the newer hide pastes will hold a DP skin but I know from MANY years of
experience that the older pastes do not.
The constant shrinking and swelling caused by the humidity and dryness
will pull a deer head apart. I have seen it too many times to risk using it.


Ever See a Mummy?

This response submitted by Bill Gaither on 3/29/01. ( ) 64.196.210.111

It works. I have mounted many full mounts and shoulder mounts by the dry or siccative method. When I first started taxidermy, arsenic was used widely and not always so carefully to aid in the protection of mounts. The borax method and later other concocted dry siccatives work by shrinking the tissue around the base of each hair, locking it in place. Borax, used properly, works. There are some heads over bars in my native state that I mounted forty years ago by that process. It is a lengthy and time-consuming process if done properly. Borax or koraxum compounds have the atomic half-life of a Hostess Twinkie and prevent mold, bacterial and insect attack.

Mind you, I am not advocating that over proper tanning procedures, I just want to go on record as an endorser of the process.


Wrong!

This response submitted by Matt on 3/29/01. ( mbchoate@twlakes.net ) 207.144.243.89

Sorry guys but You can get a quality mount from DP and have it still look just as good 30 years from now .

As for the dormant diseases and stuff......that is crap....A properly fleshed, thinned and tumbled cape washed and tumbled will not hold any type of diseases or pathogens at all...Old Wives Tales and Urban Legends abound everywhere...

I tried tanning...Worked decent....But you cant tell the difference in the Tanned cape and the DP cape except that in one I have over $5- invested in tanning it....I am looking at the Mears Spray Tan however because I like the way the capes retain their natural eye color resulting in little painting.


LOL

This response submitted by Bill Yox on 3/29/01. ( ) 152.163.189.130

I LOVE this subject!


Just wondering

This response submitted by curious George on 3/29/01. ( ) 205.188.209.200

Matt,
Just wondering why your website says you've been doing taxidermy since '95, and already you have thousands of dry preserved heads under your belt,huh? Also a little curious about these heads looking just as good now, as ten or fifteen years ago, unless I miscounted, '95 was 51/2 years ago? While you may feel that dp is the best (or bess) thing going since sliced bread, the climatic differences between north and south play a huge role in deciding what is best for our customers trophies. Save the crap about not telling the difference too, most of your customers probably can't tell the difference when they pick up their deer, but give them an honest ten or fifteen years, and they will. Don't mean to sound as though I'm picking on you, but try and put yourself in others shoes before proclaiming your method as "Bess" for everyone. One your deerheads cross the $200 barrier, you'll begin to understand what some of us that have been doing this for 20,25,30 or more years have been saying.


I've looked :-)

This response submitted by Dave Toms on 3/30/01. ( ) 208.178.217.56

Just wanted to let Geo and Bill (my web based mentors) know that I have learned from my past mental lapses. I have checked out these DP posts but haven't jumped in...... What was that talk about teaching old dogs new tricks LOL

Dave


WHY?

This response submitted by John W. on 3/30/01. ( ) 216.166.196.216

CANT WE ALL JUST GET ALONG?!L.O.L.


800-1,00 mounts a year MR George

This response submitted by Matt on 3/30/01. ( mbchoate@twlakes.net ) 207.144.243.149

Curious George...I have been mounting at the Pro evel since 95..I work for 2 hunting lodges doing All their Taxidermy/I mount between 300-400 heads a year for one lodge and I am currently on 500 plus for the other one..All since Sept. All with Dp and All look just as good as the stupid ol pickled crap yoou guys fool with thank You...


Syas who

This response submitted by Dave Toms on 3/30/01. ( ) 208.178.217.210

Sorry Matt, but are you the sole judge on whose mount is better? I think the world show is this next week so it would be pretty cool to show up and show us tanning idiots how wrong we are. Then again, the NTA show is later this summer so you could give us a second slap there. You actually mount 900 heads a year? That is at least 3 deer, skinned, fleshed, mounted, dried, finished and picked up every day. Heck at that pace your probably right it doesn't matter what method you use. Hope to see ya in Illinois.

Dave Toms


2 CENTs worth.

This response submitted by John C on 3/31/01. ( ) 208.44.115.19

I have seen a hell of a bunch of DPed stuff over the years. I have yet to see anything DPed, maintain any good quailty after 10-15 years. Now with the advent of the SUPER EPOXIES it could happen, but IT AIN'T YET.

Yes tanned stuff does last longer look at leather on saddles and harness, even pieces used for hinges on old barn doors.

Dont even claim that the Egyptian mummies were done with DP, they were processed for months not a few minutes of rubbing! Mummies were packed completly in salt and already had other tannins processed into the body. Just watch this on tv, check educational tv once in a while.

I think Dp on haired skins in for lazy people and just an excuse. Lets see what happens to spray tan over the next 5-8 years.


2 CENTs worth.

This response submitted by John C on 3/31/01. ( ) 208.44.115.19

I have seen a hell of a bunch of DPed stuff over the years. I have yet to see anything DPed, maintain any good quailty after 10-15 years. Now with the advent of the SUPER EPOXIES it could happen, but IT AIN'T YET.

Yes tanned stuff does last longer look at leather on saddles and harness, even pieces used for hinges on old barn doors.

Dont even claim that the Egyptian mummies were done with DP, they were processed for months not a few minutes of rubbing! Mummies were packed completly in salt and already had other tannins processed into the body. Just watch this on tv, check educational tv once in a while.

I think Dp on haired skins in for lazy people and just an excuse. Lets see what happens to spray tan over the next 5-8 years.


FYI

This response submitted by Matt on 3/31/01. ( ) 207.144.243.57

Fellas...I Mount 6-8 animals a day on top of 4-5 hogs fleshed a day 6 days a week. Dont believe me just come on up to Tennessee and give a hand. DP when properly done will not crack/split, tc.


my dad has a mount done in 78 and it has yet to crack anywhere and looks as good as the day he brought it home. Again I will say that it is all in the technique! I have seen just as many tanned capes crack and split as well!


OK

This response submitted by Dave on 4/1/01. ( ) 208.178.217.239

you have proved your point.... well maybe you haven't? Why not come to the shows and prove us wrong. If you mount 6 to 8 animals a day then you must work 24 hours a day. That gives you 3to 4 hours max for each one (not counting the hog fleshing, eating, bathroom breaks, computer jokes/cracks, etc.....) I guess I would have to see it to believe it.

Dave Toms


Seminar

This response submitted by Critter on 4/2/01. ( crttrs99@jvlnet.com ) 216.145.182.85

MAN! I think the world show should have you give us a seminar on how to do 7 QUALITY heads in a day! Sorry buddy it just don't happen, I'm not of the negative type but your way over your head here talkin' to experience. Even if you can produce them in a day you soon won't, eithe from disatisfied customers or because you'll be too busy repairing the past mounts.
critter


Where in Tennesse?

This response submitted by JOhn C on 4/2/01. ( ) 208.44.115.75

Where, I may just comeover and watch! You never know. Where you in Memphis at the SRTC?


I prefer tanned

This response submitted by BigD on 4/2/01. ( roofer@gointer.net ) 209.173.39.82

Back in the 80's I learned to mount using dry preservative. In 1986 when I started going to the State and regional taxidermy show's I learned about tanning. I could see the difference and immediately set out to learn how to tan. I have a couple of mounts from the "old" days that were DP'ed that still look OK. Would I ever go back to DP? No way, tanning is much better, easier to mount and holds up much better over the years.

Hey John C, I was at the SRTC in Memphis this year. I wish I had known you were there, I have been wanting to meet you.


cheap and lazy

This response submitted by rick on 4/2/01. ( ) 156.46.131.187

Dp is a cheaper and lazier way of doing deerheads. A care simply MUST be tanned for a good quality mount. I don't care if you're doing 1 or 1000 heads/yr, you must tan and shave them. Period, end of discusion! And to "1000 heads/yr" Matt, you gotta get off of that stuff before it kills you or you get arrested, rwl


BElieve what you want

This response submitted by Matt on 4/3/01. ( mbchoate@twlakes.net ) 207.144.243.46

I know how manyI mout! And I never said I done the entire process...The capes are fleshed, tumbled and ready for me to mount! I know how many I do and what I get paid for turning them out! And as for the quality ...They look great !....MANY repeats and they pay top $$ for the area...And as for the idae that I am on somethig...NOT...Get real I dont even drink!Well lets go do #3 mount for the day.....And why doesnt everyone here get off your high horses!


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