Cracking around eyes

Submitted by Brokenrack on 03/15/2003. ( ) 66.187.162.247

I got my deer mount back from the Taxidermist on 03/03/03 today I noticed what appears to be a crack on the back of each eye (Brown section around eyelid) is this normal, what could cause that, should I take it back, can anything be done?
Thanks in advance for any info you can provide!
Scott
Ps. if you want to see a pic here's a link http://brokenrack.net/buckeye.jpg

Return to Deer Taxidermy Category Menu


I'll bet

This response submitted by Roger H on 03/15/2003. ( r_heintzman@hotmail.com ) 24.220.117.54

the cape was dry tanned. No this is not normal. If it is from this past season and you have it back already yup er. Probably cheap price too! Yes take it back and have it repaired at no cost, BUT, if it is dry tanned it will probably keep drying out and cracking. Best of luck to ya.


It's from this season

This response submitted by Brokenrack on 03/15/2003. ( ) 66.187.162.247

But I was the first one there on the first day he only had a few deer from archery season ahead of me. I don't know what dry tanned means I know he sends them to a tannery. I paid $400.00 which seems about normal in my area. I think it might just be in the paint if this area is painted which I believe it is. It's in the same place on both eyes. Also I thought the neck looked small than what I shot so I measured it over the hair of course it was 24" when I took it to him after he skinned it he measured it and it was 25" without the skin is this normal. I'm sure it's the same cape though cause of fighting scars on the face.


Take it back and make him fix it.

This response submitted by John C on 03/15/2003. ( ) 64.216.172.50

Its probley a dry preseved cape, not tanned, some people even some taxidermist think a chemical called dry tan is a tan its is not, its a brand name, named to mislead people.

It also does not have a quality glue and the form was not prepped.

a 24 or 25 inch cape is pretty damn big for a whitetail or mulie. One inch dont make any differnece in that size deer neck.

Now you trusted the taxidermist at first and now you are doughting his work quality. Here is not the place to confront him, in his or her shop is. Other than the cracks everything else is very petty on your part.


Here we go again

This response submitted by MattC on 03/15/2003. ( mbchoate@twlakes.net ) 64.53.103.166

Folks..Just because it is "dry tanned" does not mean that is the reason the cape is cracking. The reason it is cracking is due to improper fleshing and thinning. A DP'ed cape will not crack if thinned super thin and used with a good Epoxy based hide adhesive...I have DP'ed deer for years and never had one crack. Geez folks. I do have 2 deer mounted using a wet tanned cape that have cracked across the nose though :^)


Beg to disagree, Matt

This response submitted by George on 03/15/2003. ( georoof@aol.com ) 152.163.188.227

I used DP for too long to buy into that. The thinner you flesh the eye ring the MORE likely it is to crack and split IF you don't epoxy clay the eyes and use a good hide paste around them. The heavier skin surrounding the eye will expand and contract with incredible pressures and the eye ring area bear the brunt of this movement. I used to oil my eye rings with Vaseline when they dried. Then I'd clean and paint them. I have a mount in my den that's almost 25 years old. I've repaired those cracks once and instead of airbrushing, I used tube acrylic artists paint. The thicker layer of paint now allows some "stretch" in the cape and hasn't cracked since.


Movement

This response submitted by Elmer on 03/15/2003. ( Tops ) 152.163.188.227

Different temp different climate. The eys had extra movement. It is around the eyelid . Which the different climate temp could cause some movement. But it is no big deal just take it back and let him know he should fix it with no problem


i agree with MattC

This response submitted by Paul on 03/15/2003. ( ) 152.163.188.227

Thin it good around the eyes and use a GOOD APOXIE GLUE. Everyone has an opinion. Thats mine. I guess George's opinion would be to not thin it too much around the eye ring. Well I don't buy into that.

Brokenrack- take it back and have him fix it. Regardless if you go back to him in the future. Might or might not save someone else down the road who has a deer done by him/her.


Didn't say that AT ALL

This response submitted by George on 03/15/2003. ( ) 205.188.209.11

Anyone who's ever fleshed a deer would KNOW that the eye lid area is always thin even BEFORE you start working them. We're not talking eyebrows here, EYELIDS. A good epoxy will hold, but not if it's on a clay base as the clay will also crack.


Cracks around eyes

This response submitted by Aaron Honeycutt on 03/15/2003. ( mhoney@mindspring.com ) 165.247.151.190

I just can't let this pass without tossing in my two cents. When I hear cracks at the eyes I think DP too. BUT another idea is that it can also happen with tanned capes that a taxidermist pushes out too quickly. If the mount is not well dried before doing the finish work and you paint with a brush the paint can get little cracks as the mount continues to dry. The skin will not break but the paint might. More common to see this on the nose pad though. Thinning the skin is very important and also there is a range of stability/quality in tanned capes depending on how they are prepared. Brokenrack, your taxidermist will want to fix your deer. Like me, he would much rather the customer voice complaints to him than to others. -Aaron H.


Could it be . . .

This response submitted by Tony H on 03/15/2003. ( ) 209.69.212.187

That maybe this is just an unusual circumstance? Maybe the guy did have it tanned professionally (though I don't see any problem with guys who did it themselves; never used DP so I can't offer an opinion on that). Maybe it's just "one of those things." Maybe it was a piece of flesh he missed for the first time in a 100 mounts. Maybe it was a bad spot in the epoxy/paste? Who knows? None of us really so I'd like to think the guy who mounted it normally does a good job for his customers just like I'm sure we all hope we do. Let's give the guy the benefit of the doubt for once. Just take it to him, show him the cracks and I bet he makes it right with no hassle at all.


Tony, no disrespect here, ok?

This response submitted by John C on 03/16/2003. ( ) 64.216.172.70

After doing hundreds of mounts and looking at hundreds of others mounts. We see certain things develope within catagories of mounts.

Cracks around the eyes are normally from dped mounts, with poor hide adhesive.

You can mount a deer without dp when you use a good hide adhesive, I wonder why the DPers waste money on dp if they use good glue?

Sure a leather tanned cape will split across the nose too, they have to final prepped.

I have to laugh at Matt a bit, two deer have cracked and they were wet tanned. Why sure when improperly done.

DP is not the best choice for Southern Climates, the humidity varies way to much. Normally it is high. One thing certain about a dped cape it you can smell to bacteria in it. UNless you are using a cover scent.

Do the Dpers not understand thats why the hair gets loose on thier Dped heads? Because the cape is spoiling and if its not touched may dry enough to hold much of the hair in, but smell thier shops! They do smell spoiled and soured.

Ever walk through a studio that use good taneries? The smell like leather. Do some research and see what smell relates to quality in consumer research!

Leather! Why is it those who want quality buy leather car interiors? Leather shoes? Purses?

If leather is not so good why are leather door hinges from 150 years ago still on old cabins and barns? Why is it Saddles are not just dped hides? Saddles have been around for hundreds of years from the middle ages.

What happens when you buy that pair of plastic shoes and they wear out in a few months, but get good leather work boots and they last a couple years.

Yes many Southern Taxidermist think dp is the way, and then they cannot understand why thier work is not worth more.

Taxidermy is a LUXUARY! Why not charge for it as such.

Do good work, earn good pay work, 60 hours per week instead of the 100 just to be hungry for more mounts and wonder why your wages are poor and you have NO PROFIT!


George

This response submitted by MattC on 03/16/2003. ( ) 64.53.103.22

I have DP'ed mounts from 25+ years ago with no hide paste and no cracking that was mounted up by a local taxidermist for me before I started doing them myself... I have wet tanned capes tanned by a LARGE, WELL KNOWN tannery and mounted using Epo-Grip that cracked within 3 years after I mounted them.

I only mount around 50-75 deer a year here but I use DP and Killer Glue and NEVER had one crack in 10 years.

The less you flesh the more likely they are to crack.


TONY

This response submitted by MattC on 03/16/2003. ( ) 64.53.103.22

Apparently you havent been to many shops...Mine doesnt stink or smell "Soured" The hair isnt "loose" in my mounts at any time and the bacteria cant be smelled..What a crock! LOL!

Tony made the mention that leather will last for ever..NOT TRUE..leather(When properly cared for) has a "Life" of about 30 years.... If it doesnt stay moist and oiled it will crack and dry.. Ever had a saddle Tony? We train and raise horse and I can tell you a leather saddle, stored in the average climate around here will dry out and being to crack and deteriorate in 5 years if not oiled each year.

You folks need to quit acting like DP is a scourge on the taxidermy world.. There has been many DP'ed mounts win and take numerous competitions. Done properly it will last forever and look as good or better than a tanned cape. I cant help it that you folks have been duped by the taxidermy bigwigs into thinking tanning is the way to go just because they hold a vested interest in tanning product companies. Its all a money racket.


Sorry Tony

This response submitted by MattC on 03/16/2003. ( ) 64.53.103.22

My post above should have been directed to JohnC :)


I Don't Know

This response submitted by Bill M on 03/16/2003. ( ) 24.48.113.78

but has Epo-Grip been around for 3 years? Anyway,where have these mounts been hanging.Take the best pair of leather boots and hang them over a wood burner or fireplace in a homne where the heat is cranked up during a winter like the current one here in NYS and you-re going to have problems. I hand out a printed list of "care" instructions to a customer when they pick up a deer head and one of the no-no's is to keep the gamehead away from the dry heat and to appply a bit of leather oil to the corners of the eyes and nose once a year. I've seen heads that have hung over fireplaces for years and they just have a very n"dry look" to them even though in many cases they have not cracked.


Sorry Matt

This response submitted by George on 03/16/2003. ( ) 64.12.96.79

We won't get into matching history since mine's probably long enough to have forgotten, but you obviously DON'T know me. I've stated thousands upon thousands of times that I STILL after 45 years DP all of my small game. Everything has a place. I SHAVED my hides for just as many years, not just fleshed them and all of my hides are down to the "blue". I didn't just fall off the onion truck. If you study some, you'll find that DP only DEHYDRATES a hide and if enough borax is added to the talc and alum, it will inhibit insect infestation. But the hide is still in the raw state. Tanning itself doesn't change much from an observable level, but adding the oils after tanning sure gives the hide a softer look and preserves it longer than a DP hide. So if you want to pick a fight over the differences of DP versus Tanned hides, you need to pick an easier target. I don't have any ax to grind at all since I use both. BTW, Epo-Grip Epoxy Hide Paste was introduced to the industry in February 2000 at the Florida state show and at the NTA. It wasn't marketed through major suppliers until the following year and now has become a common name in the industry. Why anyone would go back to Killer Glue from Epo-Grip is even more surprising.


Sorry Matt

This response submitted by George on 03/16/2003. ( ) 64.12.96.79

We won't get into matching history since mine's probably long enough to have forgotten, but you obviously DON'T know me. I've stated thousands upon thousands of times that I STILL after 45 years DP all of my small game. Everything has a place. I SHAVED my hides for just as many years, not just fleshed them and all of my hides are down to the "blue". I didn't just fall off the onion truck. If you study some, you'll find that DP only DEHYDRATES a hide and if enough borax is added to the talc and alum, it will inhibit insect infestation. But the hide is still in the raw state. Tanning itself doesn't change much from an observable level, but adding the oils after tanning sure gives the hide a softer look and preserves it longer than a DP hide. So if you want to pick a fight over the differences of DP versus Tanned hides, you need to pick an easier target. I don't have any ax to grind at all since I use both. BTW, Epo-Grip Epoxy Hide Paste was introduced to the industry in February 2000 at the Florida state show and at the NTA. It wasn't marketed through major suppliers until the following year and now has become a common name in the industry. Why anyone would go back to Killer Glue from Epo-Grip is even more surprising.


George

This response submitted by MattC on 03/16/2003. ( ) 64.53.103.199

George.... A properly fleshe, thinned and prepped, tumbled, and cleaned DP'ed cape will look as soft and as supple as a tanned cape. I a in no way doubting your experience..but I did'nt just fall off the onion truck either... I have tanned capes dozens of times as well as sent mine off to Carolina and New method..in fact I prefer mounting mammals such as cats and coyotes that are tanned but from a practical standpoint I have found that I can turn out as nice a mount using DP and save me enough in the pocket and in the time to make it practical for me t go thatropute..no if I was mounting 150+ deer heads a year I would probably send them all off..not because of the quality vbut because o the time. Deer arent my main source of income in my shop.


Return to Deer Taxidermy Category Menu