Well, Guys 'n Gals, it's time for a report. Rather than just another dry, boring text book report on my end (Which looks like a lot of people enjoy. Thanks, Folks!), I decided to "liven" it up with a contest. By the time this post is brought to a final close, you will see that there is method to my madness.
I have a new article started on hidetanning.net, but to see this article you will have to copy and paste the link below to get there from here. It will not be available from the home page until I have a contest winner.
www.hidetanning.net/DeerSkinTanning.html
There are several photos, all of the same deer cape. The photos were taken June 14, 2005.
I am going to give choice of a Whitetail Designer Systems whitetail deer reference disk to the FIRST person to post the YEAR that this deer was taken. I'll even take this one step further and give a choice of two whitetail disks to the first person to post the MONTH and YEAR this animal was taken. We can actually have two different winners like this. I will e-mail the contents of the reference disks to the winner/winners.
Do not e-mail your answer to me, post it here.
I will give full details on this cape once a winner or winners come forth. I will add those details to the web page, plus I will also add the details to this thread. I do believe there will be a number of you to find this very interesting.
Glen
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don't know a thing about deers but I guess I am going to learn something... I am guessin December of '99:)
Glen I am going to have fun also and say November 97
Glen I also don't know much on Deer but I have had quite a few furs in the freezer for some time. So I am going with November 1993
January 1995
Hows about November of 2000
How about november, 1998
11-2002. Just guess.
Still not used yet - 1994, 1996, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, and before 1993.
?
My guess, oct. 2003
October "96"
10-02
nov 2003
One person above missed by only one month.
I think it would be wise to add a link to this thread when I publish the page in it's final form.
I would have to believe beyond the shadow of a doubt that just the posts so far makes one of my cases in point.
I think this could be even more "mind messing" if the sense of touch and smell could also be utilized to come to conclusion on the age of the cape.
Let's try again for that winner/winners.
Glen
1/05
September, 2003
would probably say, "There is a winner for the year. The writing of the contest rules didn't state that a respondent could not include more words in their post, which could include the wrong month."
Those darn Pennsylvania guys anyway.
November 2004
Thanks, John
And the survey says....
I try December 1994
go for another guess yet. We still don't have a winner/winners except for the technicality win.
I finally caught on-- think John is right-- Dec 04
supose to be guesing. I think the post said "detective" in there some where. I am looking! Joe
thats my guess
is the wt taken in 1979 I am guessing the month is november? this is the only date I could find on hidetanning.net. Joe
Most responses in a couple hours I have ever seen..
I sent out e-mails to a number of people from my personal contact list in the wee hours of this morning letting them know I was making this post.
Keep an eye on the post and you will see where it is going to as a "done deal".
Now, Earl, I know darn good and well you've been doing this stuff for a "couple of days", what year, or month and year was this deer taken? Come on now, I'm looking for those expert opinions.
Ya got me stumped! I use STOP-ROT every day and I cannot tell the dif between a fresh cape and one treated with STOP-ROT I have looked and found no other dates that would go with the photo's on hidetanning.net so my final guess is June 13 2005! Joseph R Osborn (Hunter's Dream Taxidermy
?
done enough guessing on this one! I will let some one else have it! Joe
well?
?
1/03
11/96
9/96
10/00
12/00
11/96
9/02
12/02
9/03
12/03
11/01
1/01
10/97
1/97
12/93
10/93
12/94
12/95
2/95
12/98
10/98
Jen just posted the correct month and year.
Not in the manner I was looking for, but it is also another good illustration of interpretation of the written word.
Send me your choices for the two disks, Jen. Have some room in your e-mail account, these will be large files.
The PA feller also has a disk choice coming. Send choice PA.
so what was the date? I posted I knew it was but was going to let someone else have it. My guess would have been Nov. 2001 am I right? BTW Glen I have another question for ya! I will post it on the tanning forum. Joe
I'll be back shortly.
Joe, that is the correct answer. My question for you is, how did you come to that conclusion?
You actualy gave us all the answers! you have to read all of it to get it. Joe the dectective, PA. To me thats an attorney from pennsylvania. "A Philadelphia lawyer" was only a month off. so the year was 2001 and there is no month after Dec. It must have been November 2001! Eat your heart out Holmes! Joseph R Osborn (Hunter's Dream Taxidermy) BTW If I need ref. Pix I will buy them, witch is why I did not give an answer, I gave two answers just to be a smart A$$. the 1979 Pix were on the web site from 04 so that could not be the date. And you were going to play us on this one so it could not have been 06-13-2005, besides it was not a short hair cape. Well yall have fun!
and this is my Forums."
One of you old rascals might have to explain my wise crack to Joe.
Nice piece of work, Joe.
for their participation.
When a group of experienced people are stumped that says a lot.
This site provided by Ken Edwards and WASCO has just served to house information that is now publically available. Dates and times are recorded. Expert testimonies are recorded. Experts admitted to guessing. No tellin's as to how many witnesses that this information will reach.
If I had been presented with photographs like you folks saw, and it was a few years back, I would probably gave an answer like John and Andy O. gave. The cape looks fairly fresh in the photos.
I can see how that could set off an uninformed CO into thinking that he had found specimens inconsistent with date tags. I don't think I have to enlarge upon that any more, other than it looked fresher in real life than what it did in the photographs. That's one side of the coin. Now for the other. Copy and paste of the text that is now associated with the cape photos.
The cape in the photos is from a whitetail doe that I took in our early archery season the week before our gun season started in November 2001. This particular doe was slipping hair just five hours after I got her. (In an article that I had written that was originally on TaxidermyReference.com titled "CHEMICALLY INDUCED PRONGHORN ANTELOPE HAIR SLIP", that is now here on hidetanning.net I had referred to the fastest natural chemically induced slip that I had personally witnessed being five hours, this is her!)
I had checked her in shortly after taking her, and had her skinned out up to the neck at the five hour mark when I saw the slipping set in. I finished skinning her, and applied STOP-ROT. The slipping stopped immediately. I gave the STOP-ROT some time to work, and then put the cape in the freezer.
I had taken a young buck earlier on during our archery season that was the first specimen that the final STOP-ROT formulation, as it is now, was used on. I skinned him out up to the head, cut the head off and left that in the pick up cab for an over night. I skinned the head out the next day, treated the cape with STOP-ROT, let it lay around for a couple of more days, then put it under salt for about 24 hours. It was still pretty warm at that time. I ran it through the Whitetail Designer Systems and put it in the freezer.
I might point out that STOP-ROT was not released on the marketplace until 2002.
Very few days after the first doe, I took another doe during our gun season. I knew right away that I would keep this cape also and do a side by side test of STOP-ROT for long term freezing affects.
This gave me three test capes to fool with that I KNEW FULL DETAILS about.
Initially I checked on the doe capes real frequently. At the end of the first month, differences were becoming apparent. At the end of six months, differences were dramatic. I had rolled both capes with part of the flesh side left exposed for a visual check. After six months, the STOP-ROT treated cape looked as if it had just been put in the freezer. The untreated cape had taken on the "typical" look, plus had lost a lot of moisture.
The photos you will be seeing are of a cape that had been frozen for right at three years and seven months.
The reason you are seeing these photos.........
It seems the upright freezer at the end of my workbench had been left ajar on Friday the 10 th., that was the last time the freezer had been accessed. Normally, I spend a good part of my day at that work bench or in the immediate proximity, and it would have been noticed immediately. But......I had some other work I had to get done else where, and I wasn't around the freezer, or work bench until the morning of the 14 th.
That Tuesday morning I was hit with that "dead 'possum in the wall smell". I'm doing that "What thee heck?" kind of thinking and following my nose. Took me to the freezer. The door was open about maybe a half inch. All the contents were thawed. Panic time.
My upright freezer door was full of skinned out heads and bones that I keep for reference, those along with another head and neck section on the bottom shelf were where the dead 'possum smell was coming from. I imagine all the drippin's that were now directly below the door and under the freezer added to it.
I had been figuring for a long time that sooner or later someone would be reporting that they had had a freezer go out and only the stuff that had been treated with STOP-ROT was salvageable. I never once entertained the notion that it would be me making the report.
I did save the 2001 green control cape though. It was STOP-ROT treated immediately, frozen, then taken back out and pickled, neutralized, treated with Fat-B-Gone, and put back in the freezer.
I had just read the Showers vs. Spangler case. (http://pgchallofshame.com/stories/page8.htm)
I had just finished putting another thin coat of STOP-ROT on the photographed cape with the intentions of putting it back in the freezer, and then it dawned on me that I should probably make this text and photos publically available. I have came to take STOP-ROT and it's performance for granted. Not everyone knows about STOP-ROT. As you can see by the photos, it would be darn hard to establish a time of death off a visual.
the week before gun season started in November 2001 in the state that you were hunting - aaawww ,so eigther oct.2001 or nov. 2001,better late than never!
a bit before my time, When I was a kid (I,m still a kid but this was some time ago) I use to watch Nick at Nite. Ya know "car 54", "rt 60", "my three sons" I knowem all! and they say kids watch too much tv! what do they know. Joe