lip curl deer mount?

Submitted by jt on 12/1/05 at 1:02 PM. ( joshtyree@bellsouth.net ) 68.19.241.187

this guy has two canada deer. he wants both in the lip curl mount. he does not want flehmn mount. (hope i spelled that right?) he hates the flehmn mount. he only wants the mount called "LIP CURL". does anyone know where i can order a form that is only called lip curl? this guy is gonna be hard to please. thanks for any help.

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It's the same thing

This response submitted by Leah on 12/1/05 at 2:40 PM. ( ) 4.225.91.241

JT,
Flehmen is a lip curl. It allows the buck to expose the doe's scent to the vomeronasal organ so he can check her stage of fertility. I don't understand what your customer is wanting. I don't think he does either.


i know

This response submitted by jt on 12/1/05 at 4:06 PM. ( ) 68.19.241.187

that is what i told him. he would not listen. he was right and i was wrong. i think i will tell him i can's do it. i don't think i will ever please him. he said one taxidermist did him a lip curl mount and it was flehmen, so he tore it up and took the horns off it while in taxidermist shop and left fighting mad. i don't think i need his business. thanks for the input.


ask for a pic

This response submitted by Hess Taxidermy on 12/1/05 at 5:39 PM. ( hesstaxidermy@yahoo.com ) 209.74.8.254

Ask yuor customer for a picture of what he wants done. If he shows you a buck that is flehmen keep the picture for later reference then do it up and if he has a problem with it shwo the picture that how he wanted it. If it is a lip curl and he cant find a pic that shows what he wants I dont know what I would do. Good Luck, Kevin


I love these guys

This response submitted by George on 12/1/05 at 6:03 PM. ( georoof@aol.com ) 152.163.100.132

I'd have told him to take his silly assed problem down the road, they're used to dealing with people who don't have a clue. Just today I heard of a guy asking a taxidermist to mount his deer. He went to look at the nice 10 pointer lying dead in the pickup and noticed 3 large gashes down the throat of the deer. He asked what the hell had happened and was promptly told by the "hunter" that he'd made those cuts before he field dressed the deer. When asked why, the guy says, "Everyone knows you have to bleed out a deer when you kill it so the meat doesn't spoil." Now how the hell is any animal going to "bleed out" when it's heart has stopped pumping?


HIGH MAINTAINENCE

This response submitted by BRIAN SNIATECKI on 12/1/05 at 6:46 PM. ( ) 152.163.100.132

you dont need these kind of people fire mr lip curl if he can not produce a pic. That would insult me if he a customer thought he knew more about the mounts then I did. Good Luck


DUH!

This response submitted by Griz on 12/1/05 at 7:35 PM. ( ) 69.66.146.147

the guy is obviously an Elvis fan and merely wants a "side corner" flared with maybe a little nostril lift in there too!


its not a big deal, the customer is right

This response submitted by paul k on 12/1/05 at 7:57 PM. ( ) 68.83.60.41

think about it! do you guy's really think a bucks mouth and nose and everything in between goes from a closed mouth to full flehmen instantly without any other movement of mouth and nasal parts? Its not wrong for a customer to want something in between. Its not hard to do either. Ive done a few for customers who didnt want as much palate exposed or the nostrils flared as much as a full flehmen commercial type mouth piece and nose offers you can buy just the bottom parts for the flehmen mouth cup and either replace the nose or sculpt the form to any position. do a good job and your customer will appreciate a one of a kind unique mount. just remember to charge accordingly


Paul, did you know deer don't HAVE an upper lip?

This response submitted by George on 12/2/05 at 12:08 AM. ( georoof@aol.com ) 64.12.116.132

That's why our statements are correct. A deer's upper "lip" is actually an extension of the upper palate and a connective tissue to the nose pad. The "lip curl" is not a normal movement for cervids (horses, yes, deer no). The buck "lip curl" is actually used to open up the nostrils so that the epithelium can get a better sensation. In mammals, the epithelium also contains a very specialized gland (most taxidermists discover that small pouch accessed through a tiny hole in the nostil lining and think it's a sinus) that is especially sensitive the the pheremones released by estrus does. When the Flehming pose is exhibited, the nose pad rolls upward, the soft bridge of the nose collapses and wrinkles, and the nostrils flare and open in a direct line to the epithelium.


THANKS TO ALL

This response submitted by JT on 12/2/05 at 11:33 AM. ( ) 68.19.241.235

I HAVE TALKED TO SEVERAL TAXIDERMIST AROUND HERE AND IT CAN BE DONE. I JUST DON'T THINK "ANYONE" CAN PLEASE HIM. REAL BAD VIVES FROM THIS DOOD. I SENT HIM PACKING. I AM COVERED UP AS IT IS. I GAVE HIM A FEW #'S TO CALL. I WOULD HAVE LOVED THE CHALLENGE OF PLEASING THIS GUY, BUT DON'T THINK IT WOULD HAPPEN. I HAVE HAD SEVERAL LIKE HIM IN THE PAST AND THEY DON'T REALLY BOTHER ME, BUT I AM SO BUSY NOW, I DON'T NEED HIS TYPE. JUST LIKE BOBCATS, WHEN THEY BRING THEM I MEASURE THEM INFRONT OF CLIENT, SO THEY CAN'T SAY THEY ARE SMALLER AND NOT THERE CAT WHEN THEY PICK IT UP. I ENJOY TAXIDERMY, BUT YOU GET ALL KINDS. THANKS AGAIN GUYS.


George

This response submitted by paul k on 12/2/05 at 9:03 PM. ( ) 68.83.60.41

I'm just trying to make this simple. nobody mentioned an upper lip and in my above post above i never mentiontioned an upper lip, (read carefully)I mention mouth, nose, palate not the upper lip. Nor did the original post mention an upper lip. I will ask you this in very unscientific terms. Is there no other position of the nose, nostrils and palate from the time the buck goes from a closed or open mouth to a full fledged flehming condition, when he checking the air for pheremones released by these estrus does?


UHHH, what part of "LIP curl" did I miss paul?

This response submitted by George on 12/2/05 at 9:18 PM. ( georoof@aol.com ) 205.188.116.204

And from observation, the ONLY TIME there's an "in between situation" is when the buck has a series of photos taken and one "half way" is captured in a stop action sequence. When a buck is flehming, it lowers its neck, lifts its muzzle and rolls that nose pad back. When I hear that "part way" crap, it's like sneezing and keeping your eyes open - ain't happening.


ok george

This response submitted by paul k on 12/3/05 at 10:13 AM. ( ) 68.83.60.41

by your own admission in your above post, there is an in-between and there are photos that will back this along with visual experiences,
now im not trying to start debate here, only suggesting for one to use their creativity to give a customer what they want as long as the end result is a true posture and anatomicaly correct end result.
i will add i have one of these mounts in my show room, not quite as much palate showing, not as much wrinkle in the nose, nostrils not fully flared as the full flehmening buck. i will add there is a first place best of catagory hanging right there with it.


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