I have noticed alot of animosity toward other people on this forum. From personal experience I haf found this forum an excellet source of knowledge. There are so may invaluable bits of information here!
However, I have noticed too that there are alot of people who treat newer people poorly. I cant believe some of the stuff they say.
Not every person in gifted with the ability to read the archives all day, or even find them on thier first few tries. As fellow users, shouldnt we be thier guides and help them rather than bring them down?
From personal experience, I have had a few who treated me very badly! Just because a question is simple does not make a person stupid or a loser or lame. Learning is all about questions! If we never asked, we would never learn
Even if we read every book in the taxidermy industry, we cant all learn the neat little tricks of the trade that printed matter just does not make available! Some people have great ideas! Some have feedback on products that suppliers never tell you!
Some problems cant be found in the archives, and if I know taxidermists, we dont have loads of time to try and searh the archives all day for an answer. Sometimes we need a quick answer.
And does it really hurt to help someone out? Who cares if thier lazy? It does not break my back to be nice or helpful to those in need. If I can offer help, I do it! I wont shrivel up and blow away!
I just cant understand why some people have to be rude and disrepectful. I am not saying everyone is, just that there are those few turds in the bucket that have to drag everyone down. Cutting down other people is the sign of a real loser. Insecure and negative.
As a fairly new taxidermist, there have been a few comments made that really turned me off the desire to do the work. But if I did give up, those jerks would win. Tehy would succeed in bringing me down to thier level! I cant permit that! I love taxidermy, just as much as I love breathing! I dont care if the questions asked are stupid, lame, or unclear! I will continue to ask them, find them in the archives or help others with thiers. It does not hurt me, nor does it hurt anyone else.
We all had to start somewhere! Lets try and give the newbies a break. We were like them once.
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posts ive read so far. very well said,i feel the same way
You should see what they said about this over in the "beginners" forum. One fella really drove the point home!
I agree that sometimes it's easier to answer the question rather than direct people to the orange button. I also would have to say that some questions are asked way too often. You are correct that sometimes the person with the question is needing a quick answer, because he may be in the middle of the project where the question may arise. But if that is the case, and someone is waiting for an answer, the least thing they could do is use the search button, and see if they can find the answer which probably is in the archives. Another thing I see, is that when a question is asked, and an answer is given, that too often the initial poster of the question doesn't have the courtesy to even say thankyou. I'm not saying every time, but often enough! I do know from other forums I have visited, when referring to taxidermy.net, that some of the newbies are too intimidated to even ask a question on here, regardless if it is in the archives or not. For fear of the wrath of George! George doesn't scare me, and he shouldn't scare anyone else. I don't know if I have asked even ten questions since I have been visiting this forum, but they must not have been too stupid, because each one was answered, Now I either wait for it to be asked by someone else, or I search the archives, or I'm doing my part and try to give some good advice speaking from new experiences. So George, can you answer this one? Can I use unleaded gas to degrease a bird skin? LOL! I know. I know. "Hit the orange search button!" I would, but I'm right in the middle of putting out a house fire!
Sensitive people that do not know the people that have made this site what it is, must only deal with nice people in the rest of the world. Did you ever have a schoolteacher you did not like? Alternatively, a neighbor you could not stand, but lived next to him anyway. I believe the problem is up front on the web site. Nobody uses the search button to find anything. I did a search yesterday on " how to dorsal cut) 35,000 plus responses to that search that has been covered in the past. Yet, a newcomer will ask it here every week. There should be only one door to get into this site with a warning that some medicines will taste bad, but if you can stand the bad bedside manners of a Dr. that gives good medicine, you might feel better. A warning, that advise given will be from rough men that served our country and are blunt and course, people that will serve you, but maybe not the way if you were at a restaurant. I am sure that some of you offended newcomers have been short and blunt with someone in the past, or in you're own family, even daily. You are dealing with all kinds of men here, finely reformed, and rough as sandpaper. A few women here can dish it out too! If you need advice, who cares who gives it and how it is served. They cannot hurt you over a computer. I have been in you're shoes when I found this site, and have been called names, but you know, I never lost any blood over it, or gotten a black eye. Sticks and stones, will break my bones, but names will never hurt me. It is funny how you can set miles away from anybody here, behind a computer, and get you're feelings hurt. If you do not want to get you're feelings hurt on a post, stay in the archives.
that by instructing people to use the orange button, you are helping them find out about the archives and the tons of info there. I have been around this site about 2 yrs and I have watched alot of people use the orange button and find their info.. Why wouldn't you encourage someone to find the info for themselves?
So if I said:
"Use the search button ont he left side of your screen. Good Luck!"
Or I said:
"Use the search button and stop asking stupid questions. Thats what its for. Figure it out for yourself, quit wasting our time"
Last time I was nice to someone, both my legs broke and I had bad luck for a year.
Hey Q if you hit that orange button and do a search you will find this answer too. You will also run across where I have at one time or another said some of the same things. I have been here a year and you probably wouldn't meet anyone more soft hearted than I. Hang around for a while and you will start to see what some of these guys that have been here for 2 years and longer. Ask your questions if you want to but if you are told to check the archives then know that Is has been covered more then enough. If your question goes unanswered know that it is doesn't make since anyone or it has been covered. Or like in my case sometimes my fingers need a cup of coffee because they just can't seem to get the proper words out and in order and spelled correctly. Have fun and the folks here will teach you to have some tough skin. What Mr.T just told you is starting to sink in here and I am starting to realize that words on this screen aren't going to bruise anyone..
so you are not nice to others anymore? Or did you meet a stalker over the internet?
NOT
Since I know this post was In part directed at Me. I will Offer a response to you Q. I read you post in Hair slipping on face In the Gamehead forum. As is The majority of people today Q you are "Too Busy" to take the time to find your answer in the archives. Much better to post and wait hours, or days for an answer. At least then you got what you wanted with the minimum of effort. Too Busy doing Taxidermy to look up the answer to Your Question. Well, If you need to ask you probably are not much of a taxidermist. Yes, I can Say that. Because I am by no Means a seasoned professional. I spent 2 years researching, and have been actually mounting specimens for almost 1 year now. yet I have mounted Deer, antelope, bear, Impala, sheep, and almost every small game. I Defy you to find where I have ever asked a question. Not that I am a Taxidermy genus. but rather that I am smart enough to research for MYSELF. Before I take someone's time up Answering a question that has already been answered hundreds of times. Joey A. is no seasoned Pro. either. Yet he can answer most of your questions. and when he does ask one. It is because he could not find adequate information in the archives first. He puts forth the effort too. People like you Q are the reason people like Me become irritated you want everyone to spoon feed you what you want, when you want it, and how you want it. I'll bet you are the type who will sit your Bratty kid down and talk to them rather than give them a good swat too. Brian Masters
I have been checking these posts for about a year and a half. I am still relatively new but appreciate the advice given here. It is my choice to follow it or not however I have read posts that I felt were intimidating and be that as it may some people are sensitive and also may not be too computer savy. I know from my end that I do not always have time to sit down and sift through "thousands" of posts to get the answer I need and besides so what if you type it again if it helps someone its all good. I am not a lazy person just cause I don't have time to dig for stuff. I have a family, another job, 2 elderly parents I look after and my regular household chores to do, and as everyone knows searching takes a long time sometime especially when you have to go through each thread and read it only to find out thats not exactly what you needed. I am still an amature but have a fabulous teacher and I am willing to help and share anything I learned with anyone even if it was covered 101 times. You obviously have time to sit here and read the stupid questions so take a few moments and answer it. You won't spontaniously combust, and besides you were sitting there anyway. Oh well ,nuf said. Back to work. Have a good day fellows
If you know it may be in the archives, and are just too busy to look there. Then, You should know when you post, You take a chance of being told Click the orange button, Or look in the archives. or whatever. Thus you should not be offended when someone tells you that. After all it is not our fault you have too much on your plate, and have decided to take on Taxidermy on top of it. Now is it?
I am not saying that people should not look in the archives. I do all the time. What I dont like seeing is a NEW person, who has never surfed this site and doesnt know what the ARCHIVES are. I know the first time someone told me that I spent a few minute researching just what and where the archives were.
What I am saying is that isnt it better to say
"search the archive"
"try the search button"
Than being rude bay saying:
"Figure it our yourself!"
"Dint be an idiot"
"Some one asked this already, dont be stupid"
"Use your eyes"
There is a line between beeing a amart A@@ and being polite. I'll bet it fomeone went to a fine resturaunt and asked for a medium rare steak, the waiter does not say "Cook it yourself!" That guy would be either out of a job, or word would quickly spread that that resturant sucks. And I have to say, the majority of the people I know say that Taxidermists are jerks.
I dont like that repore. But I doggedly keep doing taxidermy and even help out when I can. I am not saying that we should cater to crybabies, but rather what does it hurt to be polite.
Like Nacy said, We wont spontaniously combust.
Sure if the same person keeps asking the same dumb questions, over and over every day. Ignore them. It is certainly a waste of time to answer them if you dont like what they ask.
You can choose to lower yourself and insult them, or just ignore them and they will go away. If they remain ignored, they will figure it out. Insults are not needed. They just make complications.
But thats the thing. I DON'T always know if its in the archives and I am not offended to be told that but others may. I am fortunate to have one of the best teachers in the world and can get all the answers I want and if you're attacking my life style, it is not that I have too much on my plate. I gave up ALL my life to my children and my husband and I always loved taxidermy but set my priorities early on when I decided to get married and have children. Now they are grown up and I have more time for myself so I decided to do taxidermy. However, I still have an obligation as a wife, mother, grandmother and daughter and yet I still don't mind answering anyones questions no matter how stupid they may seem to anyone else. You sound bitter and overwhelmed. I on the other hand am doing taxidermy for "FUN" and loving every second of it, oh and I still have time to help my husband clean and wax his 30 ft cruiser. Excuse me for not having hours to spend looking up answers sometimes. Sounds like you wanted more on your plate but the pot was empty. I had a few moments this morning to browse the posts in case I could help someone. I have a wealth of knowledge to share and am excited to do that. If you don't have time to answer questions where DO you find the time to be here at all?
Thank you Nancy! Thats exactly the type of attitude I cant understand from fellow taxidermists! I dont understand thier need for that high they get from being rude. I am doing taxidermy for fun. I love it. Its rewaring and a daily challenge! If people are so bitter and expect others to be bitter with them, then maybe they are in the wrong business. If you stop enjoying it, and start become Scroog over it, then maybe its time to take a new look at your life.
No the world is not harsh and cruel. If youve been knocked about a bit by it and still have such a bad attitude, like "Dod eat Dog" Then your powerfull pessamistic. Projecting that onto others is as low as you can go. I guess misery loves company.
I have learned alot from these posts and have decided that I am NOT going to join the majority to be "Popular and accepted' by being rude to every Tom Dick and Jane that comes along. If you dont have a sunny attitude (*more jibes expected about that*) Then stay out of my section of the beach.
I love taxidermy, I REALLY appreciate the polite and helpful people who have helped me, and I refuse to let the sarcastic, pessamistic, rude, discourteous, bad-mannered people rain on my parade. And up yours if you think writting a nasty post in response will phase me. It just drive my point home and labels what side of the block you stand on....which would be the rainy cold bitter side. LOL
Chris, Your analogy of someone ordering a steak is as lame as some of the ways questions are asked here. The waiter is getting paid for their time. those here are volunteers. They do not get paid. they do so freely. This is a free sight. Take what you get, and quit crying. you are not going to change things.
Nancy. I was not attacking your life style. You are the one who used it as an excuse for not wanting to take the time to research. Now since you like to be helpful.
Could you answer a question On taxidermy for Me? My hide smell bad, what is wrong? how can I fix it?
I wont change it, and B you just show what a sad lonely little man/woman you are by your insecure comments.
I feel the same way. I don't let things bother me but others might. If these guys think they are the biggest, meanest buck in the woods they can still fall hard with one good shot. Be carefull what bridges you burn you never know when you have to cross it again. I have learned a lot from people younger then me and doing stuff less years. I read alot of these posts and find that yes the archives ARE good but navigating them may be hard for people not too computer smart. It took me awhile to figure out how to get what I needed. Maybe they are here because someone said "go the the forums and ask... someone will help you" then you go and get shot at figuratively speaking. They now have a bad experience and probably won't come back adding the the Bad taxidermists out there because they felt intimidated. When I got started I must have called 5 taxidermists to find out how to get started. They all treated me the same as here. Go to school, get a book, buy a movie yadda, yadda yadda. What book should I buy, Where is a good school....There are lots of movies .. which one is best? I am not independently wealthy so where do I start. Then I found my teacher. He took the time to tell me where to start and gave me a good "leg up". That is what this forum is about, HELP. Just for future reference I am willing to help anyone, anytime. If I don't have the answer I will help you find it. Its nice to know there others out there that feel the same.
God if you are donating your time for free, I am truely sorry. Will you be nicer if I pay you? I don't have the answer for you but I will call my teacher and get back to you. I did just have a hide donated to me and it too smelled bad. But after examining it I found it WAS bad as it had already started to decay. Let me try to get a hold of Lou and I'll see if I can help. I may need more info......
I have stated my Opinions frankly without attacking or with Malice. But let's get one thing straight. One, I am not a little Man, and Two, I do not need some bleeding heart cry baby psycho analyzing me. read whatever you want into whatever you choose. But never And I do mean never presume to believe you know a thing about me. If you do not agree with what I have to say fine. Express that. Now, You come here talking about love thy neighbor, Kindness, compassion, and understanding. then when your small intellect runs out of intelligent material with which to debate. You begin insults. You Sir, or Madam are a hypocrite. You have NO right even posting a response in a debate such as this one.
Oh and it is not an excuse. I have a very fulfilling life. Hectic at times but great. I sometimes find time to look for answers but I have 6 grandkids who call when I am in the middle of things or parents who need me to pick up perscriptions cause they can't drive any more or friends who need me to move them into their new house or babysit for my grandkids. I don't think these are excuses. I choose to be helpful and not be selfish with my time but that is what I choose to do not hide behind...... Wait the phone is ringing. It might be your answer.... hold on
They say go to college to learn, but I dont see knowlegeable professors cutting down thier students for asking questions. I am not outrageously rich either and with the price of schooling in taxidermy, any help is a treasure.
Yes, I am going to school, but like most schools, and many mentors will agree, some methods work for some and some dont. One person likes to leave thier finish nails in a mount, while others prefere to use glue and pull all the pins. Its all in what you like to do and dont like to do.
Hence the forum.
I like new ideas. fresh ideas. SOme people dont like giving advice and they should not have to. If they dont like what people are asking, then they should keep thier mouths shut and not respond in a derogitive manner. There is no call for it.
How does cutting people down better yourself? Or your reputation? How does being mean to those less knowlegable make you the better taxidermist. There is no need for it.
Some like to be matcho and swing thier wieght around by bullying others and being rude. It has nothing to do with dod eat dog, whether people are stupid or not. And it does not insult your intelligence to asnwer civily.
Yet there are those who enjoy bashing others. they must have had it hard in thier lives and are projecting thier insecurities. Why push this "Better than You" Attitude. A true intelligent person would be openminded. They would not close thier minds and use derogitave words and mannerisms to shut down others. It does not make them great. It just goes to show how small and lonely they are.
So what if there are new taxidermists? Are you going to live forever? Share your knowlege and be polite. You wont go blind, your business wont go under, god wont stike you dead. And if you are losing business to a newer taxidermist, maybe its not the prices, but the attitude.
I have met all kinds of people. I have been in business for 6 years where I deal with not only clients, but emplyees too. I have studied and found that relations, no matter what business you are in, sell better than the "holier than thou" attitude. Even if a real dud comes to me. I treat him with respect and send him on his way. I do not insult, dig or harass them for thier opinions.
Inevitably, word does get around what kind of person you are. You are your own representitive. In this busness, you are selling not only your talent but yourself.
I am open minded. I agree everyone should make thier own way. But where in the book of life does it say we cant all have fun and help eachother.
If you dont like dumb qestions, dont go the the "Beginners" list to help anyone. If it wastes your time, why bother. Dont even answer, dont even read it. Go about doing your won business, do what you do best and leave those who are tolerant, and patient to help those who are ignorant and unlearned.
B, getting defensive? Have a guilty concience?
You already mad my point With your response. This post all started because I posted a response in the gamehead forum, that Q did not like. Go to Gamehead, and look on 1/25/06 entitled Hair slipping on face. Yes, My response was harsh. But truthful since it was in Gamehead and not deer. no one had any idea what species Kropp was talking about. Nor weather it was mounted, or not. The size of the slips, and the species could make a considerable difference in what procedure is used. Weather you choose to believe it of not. To politely explain things usually does little here to get someone to help themselves. they take the kindness in stride. However if you make it sound as though you are admonishing them. they remember it. The world is full of different people with different beliefs, feelings, impressions, and Values. Yours are what you find acceptable. but I am sorry. I, as well as many find mine acceptable. Ever stop to think maybe a lot of people do not like having sugar poured over them, anymore than you like being dealt with straight forward. why do those who enjoy having everything said to them covered with hearts and flowers. Think the rest of the world like it that way. in the real world when someone says something stupid. I say Now, Think about what you just said. they do, and realize how simple, a question it was. Here if you do that. you are an ogar. So I say to you are you any more Polite in pointing out what YOU believe to be shortcomings. You do not want anything I, George, or anyone else says to offend anyone. Yet you do not care if your comments offend us. See. You like many believe your way is the ONLY correct way. YOUR impression of what is rude, unfeeling, disrespectful, of offensive is absolute. what say you if I asked you Why you felt it necessary to talk to grown men who have fought at war as though they were Children. With all the niceties of innocence? I guess it is all how you look at life. But remember I have NEVER admonished anyone for talking to someone in a manner they fine Okay. F the way someone talks to you offends you, Say so, But say so for what is said to you right then and there. Not for what you object to being said to another. For all do not have the same conception of rudeness. What you consider rude. I consider frank.
Sorry, It was my son. He is on his way to Lowes and droppong by with his kids for me to play with. So guess what? Times up. My plate just got fuller! I am off to no more time land. I guess my competition mount will have to wait again. Sigh Sigh. Oh and Chris, even though you are more experienced then me I am being tought by one of the best teachers in the world. If you have any questions please don't hesitate to e-mail me. That is why I post my e-mail so as not to annoy anyone with idle chit-chat, I can do it from my own venue. I have tons of great photos that would be helpful to anyone if your looking to try some new or old methods. I have some awesome Open Mouth pics! And "B" if I get your answer I will check back later if I don't spend all day with the kids (or maybe I should send them home so I have more time for the forum) I will post it for you. C-Ya later. Good Luck Chris
No that was a more civil response. hearts and flowers as you put it are not necessary. What you just said was more explanitive than your previous response. And I doubt that your knees are broke now. Anyway. I am just saying, just because someone does not mind it does not mean everyone enjoys a slap upside the head. What is the point? Why sould we all have to endure gruffness? I get enough testosterone hosedowns at work. When I come home to work on taxidermy and I am tired to the bone and I need a break, my mind is a bit fuzzy and I have a few questions, not everything comes out sensical, but I dont mind being viewed as stupid for asking aquestion, but I dont need a smart a** comment either.
How do you know that the person you are admonishing isnt a 12 yearold kid just learining? Do you think he would want to keep learning after being insulted? I dont remember reading that in the parenting books.
Maybe they are not 12, maybe they just want a straight answer without the frills of degradation or belittleing. If you dont know who they are, you should not insult them. After all, I dont see a profile page on this site.
Real quick. I am sorry, its not about being covered in sugar its about tact. There is a big difference on HOW you deliver what you say. That is why someone who asks a question after it was asked 100 times might ask again. I have worked with all kinds of children for 20 years and granted you are not children but some people do not always comprehend the same as others and rewording the answer sometimes hits a home run. So if the answers you read in the "archives" isn't cutting it then by all means ask again. Take my mom for instance.. she only ever went to the 8th grade and has trouble comprehending sometimes, but by no means is she stupid. She taught me with love and respect so therefore I respond in the same way to others. She taught me how not to be fearful and to be careful and thoughtful to people. I bet I can deliver the same answers as you without sugar coating it and get greater respect. Remember you draw more flys with honey then vinegar! And I am going to end with that. I'll try to get you an answer this afternoon........................
Hear Hear! Couldnt have said it better myself!....
I just ran some data. Seems Chris is also Q. As well a Paschall, Havice, and a few others. Seems Sybil is a more suitable Name. Nancy you may not want to go on from hear.
Chris Or whoever you are today Let me say I have done extensive research. You under any of your aliases have NEVER posted one Iota of valuable information. all you have ever done is ask foolish redundant questions, and instigate. It is no wonder you feel so strongly about the negativity. Your ignorance causes a great deal of it. You come to a site I have contributed to and offered insightful information to beginners. And try to manipulate and dictate on what terms it should be done. Now Here is some good advice for you Take your own advice. If you do not like a post pass it by. that goes for responses as well as inquiries. If you cannot do that. Then keep your size 20 ass in the kitchen where it belongs.
.....somethin nice don,t say it at all(or write in this case)......I didn,t even read all those posts....I suppose by the soize of them.....there was a bit of slammin in there lol......
For answering the questions of this first timer. I did much research before finding this forum. Some things don't get answers in videos or books. Thanks to those who have been willing to answer my seemingly stupid questions and I have used that orange button before and not always found my answer. I see and understand now how un appreciated taxidermist's are after doing my first whitetail but I have always wanted to try it and now I see how much work it can be! Thanks for the answers from many here who were willing to share little tips and secrets that many times take years to learn. I am greatful for this forum and many here with a wealth of knowledge to share. I am simply going to take what is offered and choose for myself how to handle the responses. Thank you to those of you who have helped me, and you know who you are.
Here's my e mail just don't spam me please.
So I wonder why it is that you come up as Heath, and dan among other names? It seems that your IP address is also the same as others on this site. Hypoctrite indeed! Just "search" A persons IP address and there you have it. Everything they say and do on this site. Look before you leap B, Dan, Heath, Wilson. Whoever you are.
Chris, your not very Brit are you, and to think, you were the fastest swimmer, haha. All these people are different [ B, Dan, Heath, Wilson]