This is way 100% is so wrong !

Submitted by BobB on 1/10/01. ( foxranch@hotmail.com ) 216.165.140.84

Again, nothing against the NTA itself, but this is way this issue is so wrong
and the NTA needs to drop this 100% mandate.

It is clear to anyone reading these posts, that this forced membership idea,
will never unite us, but rather only divide us. We SEE it here, now.

This has now clearly demostrated that large state associations will go through
this same pattern of behavior - fighting between friends, members, and those
that just want to belong to a group.

People don't let the NTA do this to you. John C, I know you have way too much
on your plate right now, to be dealing with this hot potato also. I for one will
not let any of your current comments reflect on you as a true caring person.

I encourage others to do the same. John C deserves a little slack right now.

To the others, who will resort to name calling and nasty posts, please type out
your comments off-line, wait 5 minutes, reread them, then decide if you really
want to say things for everyone to see.

Yes, I am very vocal on this forced 100% membership thing. I am very local on
everything I believe in. I call my town chairman to complain on services that
I am taxed on and then don't receive, I call the members of the school board when
the fund raising efforts of the band crossed the line, I went to the principle to
report a wrongful act of a school teacher, even though it didn't involve my kid.

As a cop, I turned in other cops for wrongful behavior. As a therapist I refused to
allow patients to suffer, when I knew I could make them more comfortable no
matter how much my dept head whinned about the costs to her budget.

It's who I am, I can't sit quietly by when I see a wrong being committed. I apologize
for that. What's happening here now, was so predictible, how could the NTA not see
it coming. Mark my words this will happen within each large state association has
they deal with this mandate.

If the states drop the NTA, friendships will be ruined, as the NTA means the world
to some. If the state decides to enforce 100%, others will be just as mad and drop
their state membership thus harming the state association.

Mike K, asked me to join the NTA in a recent post of his. I told him I would, as long
as he brings an end to this 100% mandatory membership requirement. I am still
waiting still for his reply.

About support, this is not about me, but I do appreciate all the emails I have received.
Many are from names I don't know or recognize, but still others are names that many
of you know on a national basis. Those people often comment on wishing they could say
openly what I have, but are unable to, because of who they are.

Please let's stop the fighting between us, debate is healthy, but name calling serves no
purpose other than to fuel the flames

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Waiting for the other shoe to drop

This response submitted by Leanna on 1/10/01. ( scardeer@cornernet.com ) 209.98.65.74

I've been following the NTA posts quite expectantly. Why? Because something I had been wondering about, that was asked 3 days ago, seemed to get lost and unanswered in all the ruckus. It was asked by Bill Yox under the "What does the NTA do for us freeloaders" post. Yox, hope you don't mind me bringing this back up, but I for one have been dying for an answer to which you put into question. I, for the life of me, can't figure out that cut and paste crap so I had to write it down and retype it here..it should be fairly accurate with all spelling mishaps included (teasing) here it is...

"How will the NTA handle this scenario. A large state tries, but fails to get 100% affiliation. So the NTA says they can't use NTA judges, scoresheets, or whatever they plan to do. How will they still serve the NTA members (like LIFE members, in case you have forgotten those...) who still want NTA points for certification, etc, with out penalizing them for merely living in a state that could not cover the 100%? It sounds like it will have to be an "all or nothing call". 100% or no membership in that state. Guys, I'm not trying to slam the NTA and please, don't slam the NTA, just ask what will be done over and above."

Thats what I wondered and Yox asked. Does anyone know the answers? How could this possibly work? I don't know a whole heck of alot about the NTA, but am also wondering if they have control over each states associations,is that what the "national" in thier title means? And am I correctly understanding this in assuming that we will no longer be able to remain a member of our states association UNLESS we join the NTA? Thanks to anyone who will explain this to me.

And JC your offer of free classes to those of your choice is a nice thing to do.


Hi Leanna

This response submitted by Dave Toms on 1/10/01. ( dtkt@initco.net ) 208.178.217.71

The membership officer for the NTA posted a few post above yours. You could probably e-mail him direct. Mike Kirkhart also posted somewhere in all this mess. It is a good question which needs to be answered.

Dave Toms


Leanna, here is his name and e-mail

This response submitted by Dave Toms on 1/10/01. ( ) 208.178.217.56

Submitted by Mark Wilson on 1/10/01. ( RapidCitySDhomes@aol.com )


No answer CAN be given.

This response submitted by Stephen on 1/10/01. ( stephen.rogers@home.com ) 24.4.252.4

There is absolutely no way any substantial sized state association will be 100% affiliated unless the mob gets involved. If an enforcer goes around the state and has to ask the individual members for protection money from the NTA or "we's gnna break yer legs" maybe that will work. Many would absolutely refuse to join just on principle.

I posted an arguement a few days ago concerning amateurs and kids doing taxidermy that was also ignored. Taxidermy is ONLY a hobby to probably 50,000 of the proported 75,000 taxidermists listed in another posting, part-time employment for perhaps 20,000, and I would seriously doubt if any more than 5,000 people make their living ENTIRELY from Taxidermy (Without considering the spouse responsible for the Health Insurance, Retirement account etc.)
As a professional museum employee working in Herpetology, Ornithology, Trained in Mammalogy and Museum work etc. I should belong and support The Herp League, Society for the Study of Amphibians and Reptiles, American Society for Icthyology and Herpetology, The American Ornithological Union, The Wilson Society, Cooper Society, Mammal Society, Association of Systematic Collection, American Society of Museums, Society for the Preservation of Natural History Collections, The Wildlife Society, Pennsylvania Ornithological Society, Society for the History of Natural History, The NTA ,The Pennsylvania Wildlife Society, and the Pennsylvania Taxidermists Society. On the paltry salary a Non-profit pays, combined with mortgage payments, heating in winter, two kids about to enter college,etc. I choose only to join the PTA and the PA wildlife society (Which costs all of 5 dollars and holds an annual meeting and everything). I purchase only subscriptions to Breakthrough and Taxidermy Today - I can't afford subscriptions to the British Guild or Der Preparator. There is only so much money to go around.


The NTA cannot enforce 100% control - even of the judges. Suppose the PA Taxidermy association wanted to hire Bill Yox who is not an NTA member (as far as I know) and doesn't even pay the $5 to get listed in the judges book. As a scab judge (that's a joke Bill - by the way did you get Leannes bill?) is he allowed to judge a NTA life member specimen and have it count?

The argument is simply ridiculous. For the Professional Taxidermist- by all means give to the NTA till it hurts. Religion wants 10% of everything you make - and to many on this forum Taxidermy is a Religion. But some of us have morals without going to church and believe Science, Charles Darwin, and Watson and Crick contributed more to explaining our existence than any of the books that show the way to true salvation. This arguement will never be solved except in the voting booths of each state association (and lets not let Florida vote on this one).

The (tired of typing and reading) Taxidermologist.


they wont answer the question...

This response submitted by Bill Yox on 1/10/01. ( ) 205.188.209.8

...for one main reason, and this is why. They dont have an exit strategy. What they are proposing cannot be done. I wish they could see that, humble themselves to that fact, and move on to remain the respected group they have been for so long. See, now thats not nasty at all. To those who are wondering, I HAVE been a member for as long as Cindy C. can remeind me to send in my dues. From there, I just thought that it was assinine for me to not be in the judges book unless I paid a lousy $5. Yeah, I know, its 5 bucks, no big deal. So, I always upped my membership if anyone wanted their points to count. States can also have a NTA judge go back over the mount, or they used to do that. Its just a matter of principle to me. The NTA has asked me twice to judge THIER shows, so I guess its just the $5 that keeps me out of the book. Hell, its just a guide, I guess, and Im thinking my judging days are numbered anyway. I prefer to do the seminars, but getting a guy into a state show for just a seminar is kind of costly for most states, so it sounds like early retirement, doesnt it? Ha ha ha, as a competitor Ive already been "pinched" at a couple of events (they know what I mean...) so what the heck. Guys, when the NTA DOES get themselves back on track, I hope you will all join and stand up to your own words...I will...


Stephen

This response submitted by George on 1/10/01. ( georoof@aol.com ) 64.12.96.110

I don't claim the credentials you have, but aren't Arizona and Florida considered "large" states? They have 100%.


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