George Bush has had it !

Submitted by Jay Thomas on 01/21/2004. ( ) 66.19.113.69

I've been a Republican since I was able to hold a gun. I voted for Bush. realistically, Kerry CANNOT beat Bush in an election. Kerry is an idiot. Edwards, however, is another story and he may well get the vote of this Republican in the upcoming presidential election.

Two MAJOR things Bush has done to loose my vote.....................
Congress set up a law enabling hostages and pow's to sue for damages the people/country responsible for their crimes. Several of our troops did just this following their release after capture in the current Iraqui war. They won because they were tortured and they won BIG. The US government had already seized CASH accounts held by Saddam in this country. The money had been set aside for just such civil remedies. Our soldiers won, so Bush took the money and refused to allow toldiers to be paid as per the court order. When is this country going to STOP saving the rest of the damn world and start saving it's own people ? That was Bush's first mistake with me and a lot of Republicans.

Now, Bush wants to open the border and allow, not only more wetback beaners into our country, but allow the millions of illeglas already here to stay. His claim is that they can fill the jobs we supposedly don't want ! Anybody out there not want a job ? The wetbacks fill jobs like resturant, landscape, painters, sheet rockers, framers, tile, concrete, janitors, and they are slowly moving into electrical and plumbing - luckily, they are really not smart enough to get into these quickly. Never the less, they have ruined these job markets for the workers of this country. Now opening the border would be great if Vicente Fox would open his in a recipricol manner. Only a Mexican citizen can own property in Mexico. The vast corruption has undoubtedly prevented any of us from owning a piece of beach front property in Mexico. You can lease, but youmust pay off all the local officials.

If Bush opens our borders and the Republicans allow this bill to go through - I'm a democrap in this election anyway. Write to Bush if you're a Republican and let him know what we really think or be prepared to be eating beans for the rest of your life !

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Don't forget you will be paying for their health care

This response submitted by Cecil Baird ( ) 63.115.128.181 on 01/21/2004. ( ) 63.115.128.240

Do we really thing they can afford emergency health care at their low wages? But they will have to be taken care of by law so we the taxpayer will be paying for it with higher health care costs. Costs are already going through the roof due to people that don't pay.

Last time Reagan did something similar this we had a massive flood of illegal immigrants like we had never seen before. Those that became legal just invited more relatives accross the border. If we have folks that come here on worker visas how can you make them go back? Are we going to round them up and arrest them? It would be a logistic nightmare.

Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against folks that want to make a better life for themselves. But we need an immigration policy that is not a travisty and doesn't work against us. We have millions of illegals here that we have no record of. And we are safe from terroism?


Jay

This response submitted by Jim B on 01/21/2004. ( ) 169.207.126.187

"I am a lifelong Democrat. I was elected to New York's City Council, Congress and three terms as mayor of New York City on the Democratic Party line. I believe in the values of the Democratic Party as articulated by Presidents Franklin Delano Roosevelt, Harry Truman, John F. Kennedy and Lyndon Johnson and by Senators Hubert Humphrey, Henry 'Scoop' Jackson and Daniel Patrick Moynihan. Our philosophy is: 'If you need a helping hand, we will provide it.' The Republican Party's philosophy, on the other hand, can be summed up as: 'If I made it on my own, you will have to do the same.' Nevertheless, I intend to vote in 2004 to re-elect President Bush. I will do so despite the fact that I do not agree with him on any major domestic issue, from tax policy to the recently enacted prescription-drug law. These issues, however, pale in importance beside the menace of international terrorism, which threatens our very survival as a nation. President Bush has earned my vote because he has shown the resolve and courage necessary to wage the war against terrorism." --Former NYC Mayor Ed Koch


One more Jay

This response submitted by Jim B on 01/21/2004. ( ) 169.207.126.187

"I have said and strongly believe that the next five years will be crucial for the America my children and grandchildren will inherit. I want a commander in chief like George Bush. I want a man who doesn't suffer from analysis paralysis." Democrat Senator Zell Miller, explaining his decision to campaign for President Bush


Jay.............

This response submitted by Paul B on 01/21/2004. ( taxidermst@att.net ) 12.75.53.177


lighten up on the racial crap eh. I don't want people thinking all taxidermists are ignorant when it comes to people of other races. Seems like a smart person could express themself without sounding like a bigot.

Paul B


Most people vote NOT....

This response submitted by marty on 01/21/2004. ( ) 67.173.51.16

...for the BETTER candidate, but for the candidate that is the LESSER IDIOT...


Mexicans will Work

This response submitted by shooter on 01/21/2004. ( aftertheshot@yahoo.com ) 66.175.168.61

I hate to say this BUT, mexicans will take jobs that most black or white people will not take. That is why they will always have a place in this country at the bottom of the labor pool.

I have the experience in the pallet industry to back this up. I was (not too long ago) the reginal manager for a very large company who contracted to another very large company to handle their pallet pool.
I was responsible for 15 locations scattered across the Central U.S. Of all of those locations very few had any white workers. Most whites who were hired found out that the job was labor intesive and quite within the first week. Some within the first few hours. Many blacks stayed for a couple of weeks, some for mounths. Mexicans stayed as long as there was a pallet that needed to be picked up and put somewhere.
White people just don't want to work at some jobs and those jobs have to be filled. Mexicans will fill those positions.


You hit it shooter

This response submitted by b bishop on 01/21/2004. ( ) 65.73.67.39

not only that but then the we bellyache like Jay here that they are taking all of our jobs. Jay is obviously ignorant on the subject . I was skiing with my family in the U.P. the day before new years day and ALL of the workers at the ski resort were Jamacan and they were FANTASIC ! the ski hill used to hire high school kids and college students but they were worthless to say the least - all attitude . We created our own problems and now a few would like to blame the President , typical democrat though , always someone elses fault , makes me sick .


"Hispanics"

This response submitted by Jim Tucker on 01/21/2004. ( ) 24.50.252.84

I live in an area that is 98% WHITE. There is a definate "look out for those guys" and "lazy beaners" attitude here. BUT I know that the Hispanic Community is VERY hard working at jobs that most others won't do. A huge local poultry plant could not get ANYONE to work there. It was considered a losers job. They would rather collect welfare. Well, this place started bringing in workers and these guys work their asses off. It was even found that a couple were going in for TWO SHIFTS A DAY under two names just so they could get more cash. They were only found out when someone finally recognized them! These guys want to work, AND appreciate the job. My wife worked with many Hispanics at a plastics job she had. All the white trash just stood around and bitched about how hard they had to work. The Guatemalens working there worked rings around the other people. Most Americans think everything should be handed to them on a silver platter. Very few do an honest, decent days work. AND IT IS NOT JUST "YOUNGSTERS". My son had a summer job working for the Department of Transportation doing electrical work while he was waiting to get into college. He used to tell stories on how little they did every day. He would get there at 7 am. At 9 they would work for a half an hour, then go on break. Come back work for a little while, go to lunch. Sit around after lunch "relaxing" and then work a little before "closing up shop". He was shocked and it made him VERY nervous. The worst part was that they got WAY AHEAD on their work because he worked so hard this summer. He says he will NOT be going back there this year. This is the par for the course in America these days: "Pay me for sitting on my ass or I'll just take welfare."


bush re election

This response submitted by j.t. on 01/21/2004. ( ) 152.163.252.166

you all r so crazy. yoou act like bus is out here protecting us all on his own. WAKE UP, its the servicemen and women of this country. 9/11 would never happend if bush hadnt got in. it was retaliation toward bush and his father. there has been not the first attempt since then and its not because of the wars. terrorist are right here right now. you talk about terrorist snd you have americans killing americans everyday. how do you protect us against ourselves. AND YOU WORRY ABOUT TERRORIST. what about MCVEIGH he was american and all the others in oklahoma. you worry about whats out there and its all right here. BUSH,also wants to take our overtime and make us work and be paid like mexicans. what about our children and grandchildren on this subject. all these tax breaks that my 8 year old daughter will be paying for. what about jobs? ive been laid off for 4 months the longest in my life. there are no jobs. Bush only cares about the rich man. last night he talked about steriods in sports. i think he should have a lot more to worry about then a athlete taking some steriods. BUSH IS A LIAR AND A FAKE. if you cant see it your blind. where are the chemical weapons in iraq? there not there thats why the inspectors that went over prior to the war couldnt find them. men and women are getting killed over oil. PULL THEM OUT OF IRAQ U JERK! what if it was your children or grandchildren over there getting killed.korea is a bigger missle and chemical weapon threat to us than iraq, but i forgot, they dont have enough oil to mess with. this country was in the best shape it had ever been in within 50 years when clinton was in . a peaceful country, compared to now. the economy was great when clinton was in. jobs for everyone and pretty good pay. all i can say is GEORGE DONT LET THE DOOR HIT YA WHERE THE GOOD LORD SPLIT YA!


What our children will inherit

This response submitted by Superpig on 01/21/2004. ( ) 198.81.26.46

is the biggest deficit in US history, the most expensive health care in the world, college tuitions which will be unaffordable for anyone but the highest income families and an evironment that has been polluted beyond repair. Doesn't look like a too bright of a future if you ask me.

We cannot defeat terrorists we can only keep them in check to an extend. The terrorists have to defeat themselves, in other words, the countries who support them have to come around and see the terrorists for who they are and put a stop to it. All the bombs and invasions of middle east countries are not going to stop the terrorists, it only will breed more of them.

Saudi Arabia, which is the biggest sponsor of terrorists, is our so called friend due to the oil reserves it has. Unless we come up with an energy source that makes us independent of other nations, we will let Saudi Arabia do what it wants and hush up its terrorist connections. It is not in the interest of the current government to find solutions to the energy problems since the country is run by oilmen itself (mainly Bush and Cheney).

Sooner or later there will be another big 9/11 happening right here on our soil. It is inevitable as our borders are still as easily penetrable and resemble more a slice of cheese then a solid barrier. Just look at all the thousands of Mexicans coming illegally into this country every year. You think the terrorists don't know how porous the Mexican/US border is? Think again.

And how many Americans are going to be willing to spend their own taxdollars to improve the living conditions in foreign countries like health care, education, public transportation etc. when millions of Americans can't afford health care themselves, can't find work, loose their homes due to lack of job and help from the government. I know of no industrial country in the western world (mainy Europe) where you see whole families with little children living on the street and are homeless because they can't even afford a place to live. I do see that in the third world countries all the time.

We need to start taking care of our own and not throw them to the roadside. America is in a pathetic state right now.

Before you start attacking me I am not a liberal nor a conservative. I like to be independent and think for myself.


4 months OFF WORK!

This response submitted by Jim Tucker on 01/21/2004. ( ) 24.50.252.84

When I hear this I think of my dad. My father was a very hard worker. If he ever got laid off he had a job within' the next three days. My brother worked at a place where they went on strike for 6 months over .25 cents! I don't know about YOU but I have never been OFF WORK for 4 months. SURELY there are jobs out there? Maybe not what YOU WANT, but they are there. It cracks me up when I hear people say "I have been out of work for ___ days". I always tell them "I know where you can get a job tomorrow" and I do, but they always say "I won't work THERE" or "Naw, I am just going to collect unemployment". When you get laid off, don't blame the government, blame the CEO's of your employer. They are the ones that need to keep the company afloat.


Points to ponder

This response submitted by Mac on 01/21/2004. ( ) 216.54.8.18

Typically I do not like to comment much on politics but there are a few points that probably be expressed in regard to the conversations already posted. As for the Spanish immigrant issue, you have to look back 20 odd years and at the progression which has led us to present day. Bottom line, many Americans got lazy and greedy and will pursue only that what they have to do and nothing more. It hurts to say, but it is fact. They (Immigrants)have filtered into many positions and facets of industry and the people who hire them love them. They work (typically) for a lower wage, work more efficiently, complain less and do the job they have to do and do it until it is done. What more could an employer ask for? If Americans worked this way, we would not have this problem today, period. The immigrants have one thing that many Americans do not have, the need and the incessant desire to improve their life. They (for the most part) come from virtually nothing and have everything to gain. This is not to say that there are not Americans out there in the same boat, but you typically do not see Americans work and strive as hard as they do. As for Irac, the biggest mistake America made (in my opinion) was not taking out Saddam when we were there in 1990/91. 12 years of sanctions and resolutions proved and accomplished nothing but supressing innocent people. Saddam Hussien was exactly as he was described. A ruthless inhumane individual who cared nothing for his people, just for himself. J.T., you asked where the chemical weapons were, well some of it unfortunately Hussien has used on his own people, and not to mention on some of his neighbors. I agree, the pretense that Bush used to go into Irac originally sounded solid and appears to have come up short, but Intelligence is a tough game to playand you have to go with what you got when you got it. (My friends from the Seal Teams can attest to this.) I believe that Hussien had the weapons,that fear was ever present while I was in the Red Sea during Desert Shield/Storm. I would not be suprised if they were shipped to Syria, Jordan or any other adjoining country as was the money Hussiens & his sons withdrew from the Iraci banks. The fact is, what's done is done. We have to contend with what we have. There have been many complaints about Bush, some warrented and some not, but I have yet to see the person who has come up with that "better plan" or idea. Maybe I have missed it or maybe just haven't done my homework enough. I am reserving my vote this round because I have yet to see a better option come down the pike. True Bush has definately seemed misleading, but aways remember that things are not always exactly what they seem. In the position that Bush is in, he has access to information that we shall never know about nor see. He bases his decisions on that information and must make those decisions, right, wrong or indifferent knowing full well that there will always be people who oppose his views and actions. That goes for any President. Ok, nuff said, just remember to do your homework prior to voting this time, don't forget to look at the grassroots policies of the candidates (their views on gun control, ect) which will affect us directly here at home and have a direct impact on what we do. We just have to choose the lessor of "evils" presented to us. Just thoughts to ponder.


I am still waiting for an answer on who will

This response submitted by Cecil Baird ( ) 63.115.128.181 on 01/21/2004. ( ) 63.115.128.207

pay for the health care of these low paid immigrants? I think you know the answer. And futhermore if you've ever registered your kids for school you will find they are getting lots of help from the local government with books, lunches etc. due to their low wages. That's O.K. with me, but when we invite more in we are making it harder and harder for local government to do this without raising taxes. In my state we the property owners take the hit the hardest as the hispanics typically don't own their own property. My town has a high hispanic population and my property taxes will double this year.

I must be one of those folks that would take those low paying jobs. I worked right beside hispanics in a low paying factory for several years while I built my taxidermy business. I left because I was able to do better self employed -- not because I was lazy.

I did see one thing that really irked me about the hispanic culture. They worked hard when they were there, but when asked to work overtime and agreeing to it they never showed up. I was told if I did this I would be fired. And some were not as hard working as it said although overall I believe they are.

Good post Superpig.


Good posts on all accounts.

This response submitted by Mac on 01/21/2004. ( ) 216.54.8.18

All the positions brought forth in this forum are valid. Super Pig & Cecil, you present valid information that all citizens should be aware of. I definately agree that we should take care of our own people first as no other country is going to. Cecil, I hope that you did not take offense to my statement about "Lazy Americans". There is always 2 sides to every coin. The fact you were able to build your own business takes the drive and initiative I was talking about and so many others do not have it. I have a son about to graduate high school and not being, and I do not say this in a discriminitory fashion, "minority" I am having a time locating grants and other funding other than loans for collage, so I understand your point. No matter what president is in office, we are the ones to carry the burden of their decisions. It is nice to know that there is a forum where these things can be discussed and not have too much fussin & cussin. Talkatcha later.


Super pig

This response submitted by Chuck on 01/21/2004. ( ) 24.154.39.13

Superpig what do you suggest we do about terrorism? Roll over and play dead? A dead terrorist is a good terrorist. The truth is there are no easy answers about Mexicans, terrorists, deficit, pollution or energy. So what would you do Superpig, Cecil. " If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem. I think Bush is doing a pretty good job. Besides, he did inherit some of our problems from Clinton.


Health Care for low paid immigrants.

This response submitted by Jim Tucker on 01/22/2004. ( ) 24.50.252.84

Not to stir the pot again BUT IMMIGRANTS are not the ONLY ones taking FREE healthcare, I KNOW I spent 17 years working in the Healthcare Industry. Now I am a W*A*S*P so before anyone gets the idea I am someone who is just defending minorities, think again. Like I said I live in a 98% WASP area of the country. There are PLENTY of WHITES living off the dole here, with FREE healthcare. THESE people are taking just as large, if not LARGER share of tax dollars as minorities. In fact, I would say in THIS area there are more WHITES on the dole than the "immigrants". Most of the immigrants HAVE JOBS because they will WORK wherever there is work! Because of this they have benefits and healthcare.


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