legality of selling animals off the internet?

Submitted by dnr officer on 03/14/2004 at 00:03. ( ) 66.82.9.13

question...how legal is it to sell these animals over the internet? i mean anyone could be poaching these animals that are for sale. also dont dnr people check up on taxidermy businesses? how would one explain a mount that you made in which you aquired over the internet or selling one for that matter. say you found and animal that was roadkill how do you prove it? or saw someone came in with an elk cape that he killed last year, but he doesnt have an elk licesnse right now? someone fill me in cause i dont want to get in trouble with the law. thanks

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You tell us?

This response submitted by JOhn C on 03/14/2004 at 00:23. ( ) 66.233.157.155

Ok, thousands of fox, coons, coyotes and deer are shoot every year.

So I buy a fox, either locally with a furbearers permit or buy one from a dealer who may be a trapper too. If I buy it then there is the paperwork trail right?

As for deer capes, again thousands are killed each year, really think about this meat proccessors get them free and make a few bucks selling them.

Fish, well many fishing tourments kill fish with each tourement, not all the fish but there are fish that die. These fish can both be eaten and mounted.

As for getting that persons license number, if he dont have it either dont take it or get names, address and phone numbers and driver license numbers. Cover your butt.


I agree

This response submitted by Travis on 03/14/2004 at 07:54. ( ) 68.102.253.173

I see people from Kansas selling fresh bobcats/coyotes on here all the time which is ILLEGAL..Yet I make a nice post to inform them about what they are doing and I get slammed from other Taxidermists---well folks sorry but the law is the law..I pay my 100.00 bucks a year to be able to purchase furs so why shouldn`t I inform them that they are breaking the law? The last post I made a few weeks ago I got a response from another "no name" taxidermists who stated "it doesn`t matter who you sell them too because most of us are licensed taxidermists"...sorry but in the state of KS you can only sell raw furs to licensed fur dealers---NOT LICENSED Taxidermists..anytime I purchase raw furs over the internet or locally I have to log it in my fur dealer books, along with the sellers trapping license number, address, and phone number...quite frankly it`s became a free for all around here...either people should push to have their laws changed/updated or quit breaking the law...


Paper trail

This response submitted by Marty on 03/14/2004 at 08:53. ( ) 63.155.216.51

I recently came across this very question in ohio. I had an intense inspection from the area wildlife investegators. I asked what the requirements were for buying and selling items on the interent in this state, I was informed that a paper trail was required i.e. receipts and names, address, and phone numbers, trappers liscenses. etc. I also process deer and was informed that I need the hunter information on spare capes and need to have them logged in. Even if I buy, say a fox from any fur bearer to make a display mount I am supposed to have the hunter info and receipt.


dnr officer

This response submitted by Len on 03/14/2004 at 09:02. ( lengums@wi.rr.com ) 24.209.159.239

I am assuming that you are a dnr officer in name only, as DNR Wardens do know the laws of their state and it is very easy to check the laws of other states. In today's time, you almost have to be a lawyer to try and stay on top of the taxidermy laws in buying and selling hides as every state is different.Dealing in taxidermy law here in Wisconsin along with working with the DNR, I find it hard to try and figure out every little law.I also have found that many taxidermists do not know their laws.Here in Wisconsin, your fur buyer's license is included in your taxidermy permit, but now you have to research the laws on the other states that you may be buying from. You are the one responsable for knowing your laws, so contact your local warden whom should be more than willing to assist you. Good luck.


if you are

This response submitted by michael sestak on 03/14/2004 at 10:08. ( ) 205.188.209.10

a DNR officer then you have the answers, stop trying to bait people into giving you what you want to know about them, then researching their selling and buying history in order to bust them....if possible.
you sir, are a disgrace to your profession and should be fired for performing an illegal act....entrapment.


Always scared and afraid to act--?

This response submitted by Mr. KIm on 03/14/2004 at 14:18. ( ) 64.12.116.205

So, someone "has to" be doing SOMETHING wrong, right? Too many Laws and too many people looking to take advantage of those that TRY to obey the Laws. The facts are: the government in all of it's forms --DON'T trust the public AND the public...DON'T trust the Government.


The time will come when people will have to "get permission" to go to the bathroom in their own house. Do we EVER really own anything like a house or land anyway? answer: NO! --If you don't believe it, stop paying the "taxes" on it and see what happens..........Paid for is paid for, right? Not really!

LAWS....SUBJECT TO INTERPATION BY THE CURRENT ADMINISTRATION AND WHATEVER WILL BRING IN MORE MONEY AND TAKE AWAY THE MOST FREEDOM FROM THE PUBLIC......AND MOST PEOPLE DON'T EVEN REALIZE IT.

I forgot to get permission to post this info......Oh Well!


Travis I see your point

This response submitted by Eric on 03/14/2004 at 15:04. ( ) 204.96.148.68

Travis I know what you mean in kansas. I know several people that sell animals on this site that don't even have a furharvestors license let alone check who they are selling to. I once asked a CO around here about this and showed him this web page. He said he had never heard of the web site and seemed surprised(in my opinion) that there was a site where you could buy and sell such Items. For example I have a prairie dog form sitting in my garage. I tried mounting one unfortunately I messed it up and need another prairie dog to try. My understanding Is I can't buy one off of this website even though I would like to try my hand at another prairie dog mount.
Just my thoughts also


Eric

This response submitted by Travis on 03/14/2004 at 16:25. ( ) 68.102.253.173

You can purchase another prairie dog but it will have to be tanned first...not a raw skin...The ks public can buy and sell tanned furs but not raw pelts...quite frankly I believe the law needs to be worked on and easily understood by the general public. Most folks are just ignorant of the law and are breaking it without realizing it...course it`s still their fault for not finding out the correct info..."interpitation" is another good point brought up by somebody...things need to be simplified and in black and white so opinions don`t run the law...call one F&G officer and then another and the chances are you`ll get 2 seperate answers..sad but true..The bottom line is that KS needs to require a Taxidermy license because by law nobody is allowed to have frozen(raw pelts) in their freezers after april 1st, yet there isn`t a taxidermists in the state that doesn`t have raw skins in their freezer...a problem of contridicition in itself...even though I have asked game wardens about this in the past I just get a shrug of the shoulders...so I`m all for a Taxidermy license in the state of ks...


fur lic

This response submitted by ss on 03/14/2004 at 18:45. ( ) 216.221.108.70

most states you need a FUR BUYERS lic, license to buy green fur,with the lic you have to keep a log of all fur bought and send in a report, here you actually need one to buy a green deer cape,not to many taxidermists worry about it..and i dont know anybody that has been wrote up for a deer cape YET.... and if the animal is sent across state lines, even if it was legely taken,taged,etc.. it can fall into the lacy act stuff...because the buyer of the fur doesent have a lic.and bought and sent from one state to another.. i have went over this with a federal and state agent in DETAIL....thats why some will only sell to someone with a fur buyers lic.they know the laws. after the skin is tanned it can be sold to anybody..in any state as long as its legal to possess in given state. (example no lions to calf)
really not much different than selling wild ducks,
check it out...........


Not true Travis

This response submitted by scott on 03/14/2004 at 18:54. ( ) 64.39.203.95

I am a Kansas taxidermist and licensed fur dealer.I recently have been on the phone with Emoria,Oratt and Wichita.They all told me different things but if you are doing taxidermy and have animals with customers info it is legal.I know there is nothing on the books as far as taxidermy and I had a question if I could do bobcats from Louisiana without CITES tags.I talked to the Feds and they said CITES is for International export only,to call the State.I called the state and Louisiana passed some laws this year stating any big game permit holder could legally harvest 1 bobcat with that big game tag without any further tagging.I said can it be shipped across state lines for me to taxi since it was legally taken and there is no buying or selling and they said all I need is customer info.If cats are kept within the US,it is up to the state to determine shipping and tagging to cross state lines.The problem is our laws are center around buying,selling and raw pelts.Not taxidermy work.


Help in N.C.

This response submitted by susan on 03/14/2004 at 19:52. ( designhabitat@earthlink ) 165.247.177.217

I'm going through something related to these "opinions" and can't find a copy of the laws pertaining to my "problem". Have any of ya'll ever created a varmint from scrap whitetail deer hide(Marvin the Martian, a Moon Booger, or just a fantasy creature from your imagination..)? I been told I could make as many of these as I want-to keep or give away, but I can't recoup my labor costs-legally! What do you think,or know about these laws? Any ideas on how I can get something on paper relating to this(other than my local wildlife officer)? Thanks for any help


Scott

This response submitted by Travis on 03/14/2004 at 21:30. ( ) 68.102.253.173

I agree Scott---That`s why I say the state should make some changes or make us get a taxidermy license...what about Taxidermists who use their license to acquire furs to mount and sell themselves..like on Ebay, or other auctions...there lies another gray area...I don`t like looking over my shoulder---I`d mush rather have things VERY clear in black and white..


I argued this

This response submitted by scott on 03/15/2004 at 08:28. ( ) 64.39.203.15

I said so if a sprinkle borax on the skins then according to your law,it is legal since the law says in raw,natural state.I have kept documentation from everyone and their answers.There is talk that they are considering lifting some of these regulations because they aren't endangered species in all states as some have bounties on them as a nuusiance.


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