A Very Important Poll (please awnser if you have time)

Submitted by JOE on 1/4/05 at 12:07 AM. ( joehunter581293@sbcglobal.net ) 68.249.0.37

Hi I would like to know how you guys feel about drowning a animal to kill it. I am not a anti I am just trying to prove a point to a guy on this forum he knows who he is. Do you feel it is Humain to kill a raccoon by drowning it? Do you feel that is a perfectly resonable way to dispatch it? A simple yes or no would be greatly appreciated by anyone. Thanks for your time.
JOE

Return to The Taxidermy Industry Category Menu


poll

This response submitted by Chad on 1/4/05 at 12:12 AM. ( ) 209.143.56.84

No


yep

This response submitted by === on 1/4/05 at 12:20 AM. ( ) 70.178.74.104

thats why you set a drown set.


if you are a 13 year old kid

This response submitted by jimsoverns on 1/4/05 at 12:24 AM. ( ironwolf_1@msn.com ) 65.54.98.144

and have no gun,,and not enough experience to dispatch with a club,,,drowning would dispatch the animal without damage to the pelt,,and its faster than you think,,,,,,,,,,,yes,,drown the coon,,,,,,,,,jim


More humane than a less than dead -on- impact shot

This response submitted by Hogger on 1/4/05 at 12:34 AM. ( ) 4.7.214.38

Atleast scientists tell us that drowning is actually fairly painless. It's the psycological panic that is the dread of drowning. A marginal gun shot on an animal is probably more painful and inhumane. And I was refering to humans. In my book we are above animals. So I'd have to say drowning is okay providing it's not just for kicks. And it should be full an uninterrupted submerssion, not up and down so the animal has to fight for dear life.

An animal drowns in a minute or two. It takes longer than that to kill a man in the gas chamber!


Dead is Dead

This response submitted by cur on 1/4/05 at 2:56 AM. ( ) 4.252.242.29

I would think a chemical injection would be more humane, but hell, dead is dead, I reckon. I hate to see any animal suffer at my hand or anyone elses. I should think a whack on the head with a club would be much more humane. Your talking about a five minute death sequence, and personally, I think that is cruel.


For some reason I can accept this with a mink or muskrat

This response submitted by Cecil on 1/4/05 at 6:59 AM. ( ) 64.184.33.169

but not with a raccoon. Not logical I know but that's the way it is with me. Furthermore if you don't take the right precautions a coon could be quite dangerous.


You can turn that around too..

This response submitted by tomdes on 1/4/05 at 8:43 AM. ( mapletax@twcny.rr.com ) 148.183.241.15

by asking Cecil how does he kill his fish? He drowns them with air...


Jeez, why not get fresh roadkill

This response submitted by Junipera on 1/4/05 at 8:43 AM. ( ) 66.66.1.216

the whole scenario is really marginal--- a Havahart trap in the backyard , kid unsure of how to dispatch a lively raccoon, unsure of how to skin it, etc.


I couldn't do it

This response submitted by Evelyn on 1/4/05 at 9:00 AM. ( ) 152.163.100.134

Just the thought of drowning to me is cruel. Like Hogger said the psychological aspect of it seems cruel to me. Imagine yourself drowning. I think I'd rather we clubbed or shot then drowned, this way I wouldn't know what's going on. Same on an animal. Quick shot to the head or injection I think is the most humane way on a mammal, live freezing is the way to go on a reptile.


No

This response submitted by David E. on 1/4/05 at 9:12 AM. ( ) 205.168.249.154

Humane 1.Kind, sympathetic, merciful, etc. No matter what method is used the end result is the same. For a young one starting out with a havahart trap, drowning is the safest and most efficient way.


no

This response submitted by bw on 1/4/05 at 9:42 AM. ( ) 65.114.92.148

i wouldnt want to drown. id much rather take a shot to the head.

i bet a coon would too


i cant believe

This response submitted by mark on 1/4/05 at 9:52 AM. ( ) 66.255.208.13

we are having this conversation


While I have to admit........................

This response submitted by Swampfox on 1/4/05 at 10:07 AM. ( ) 216.81.99.97

that drowning is not what I would do to dipatch a coon, there are worse ways for one to die, I guess. Ever think about how many animals die every day from injuries substained from automobile tires while just trying to get across a road? Our machines, in which we travel in luxury, have created more pain, and suffering for countless numbers of wildlife than hunters, and trappers combined. Ever think about dragging your pain wracked body tru the bush after a michelin squashed you from the hips back? Nature, has cruel ways for sure. Like eating an animals rear out while it is still alive and watching you, for instance. I personally, wouldn't want to go like that. Thats why I don't swim around in the big salty pond where critters like jaws, might be looking for lunch. I guess we should ask ourselves what is an acceptable ammount of agony before death? No one will ever agree on that one.


Ever been on a hunt?

This response submitted by JTM on 1/4/05 at 11:06 AM. ( ) 63.161.168.3

The dogs tree the racoon or follow the scent to a racoon that is already in the tree. A hunter shines light into the tree top until the racoons eyes glow from looking at the light. The hunter then shoots at racoon and hopes that branches do not deflect bullet, but often they do. The racoon aften falls from the tree wounded and puts up a hell of a fight with the dogs until they dispatch the racoon. Is this any less humane? I guess you could look at the hunt as a justified way of killing a racoon, even though then end result is often still the selling of the pelt.

I there a humane way to be killed?

My two cents.


No I don't Tomdes

This response submitted by Cecil on 1/4/05 at 11:08 AM. ( ) 64.184.33.169

"You can turn that around too..
This response submitted by tomdes on 1/4/05 at 8:43 AM. ( mapletax@twcny.rr.com ) 148.183.241.15
by asking Cecil how does he kill his fish? He drowns them with air..."

You're ASSuming here. I DO NOT drown them with air. I usually overdoze them with an anesthetic used in the aquaculture industry known as MS222. Or I use Clove Oil. In the future I may be using CO2 gas pumped into the water. They basically go into a deep sleep and never come out of it. It has the benefit of not allowing the fish to damage itself when placed in a cooler full of water with this chemical. A slow death and thrashing around in the cooler with other fish reduces the value of my product by lossing scales, splitting fins etc. I don't want that.


No

This response submitted by Becky P on 1/4/05 at 12:17 PM. ( ) 205.188.116.134

Not humane. I also don't believe in letting the dogs finish them off.
We do not have to be as cruel as mother nature, we have other means at our disposal. BP


Middle of the road response ...

This response submitted by Nancy M. on 1/4/05 at 12:31 PM. ( ) 65.54.97.195

If its caught in a live trap I would probably drop it in my pond trap and all and drown it. The reasons are:

1. I don't want to get close enough to it to try and give it an injection. I LIKE my fingers!

2. My attempts at clubbing animals have been very unsuccesful.

3. I don't want to panic it even MORE by grabbing it and trying to get it out of the trap.

4. I have drowned animals this way before and they appeared MUCH less distressed than I had feared.

5. I don't want to try shooting through the wire mesh of the trap.

Now, if the animal were in a leg-hold trap or some other kind where I COULD get a clean shot, I would give it a single shot to the head.


i have never drowned an animal...

This response submitted by Griz on 1/4/05 at 1:35 PM. ( ) 69.66.87.109

And never will.

If a beginner can't find a better way to kill an animal than they need not be trapping.

If someone drowns something they should have to watch it die.


If you can't shoot something in the head to kill it then you don't need to take the shot.


Dogs aren't for killing coons they are for tracking them.


Killing is the absolute worst part of the hunt but is a necessity and we should do that as fast and painlessly to the animal.


If you can't catch coons in conibears or at least check your footholds daily you ain't got no business trapping, so don't try to say drowning sets "give you more time between checks".


The least you can do is knock it out before drowning it, kinda like the first shot of a lethal injection.


Yes

This response submitted by Brian on 1/4/05 at 1:40 PM. ( ) 67.50.234.207

Yes.........and Cur,I take it you've never "whacked" a coon on the head to kill it. Let me tell you, thats a five minute ordeal as well; even if you're Barry Bonds! I don't think much of using phrases like "death sentence" when it pertains to animals, and especially a varmint like a racoon. Most people think that racoons are cute, including me, but to accept the drowning of a rat or mink (Cecil) and not a coon is hypoctritical. I've trapped thousands of predators in the last 25 years and I'm convinced that trappers understand the cruelty of nature better than most who spend time in the outdoors. You realize that what nature does to animals pales in comparison to a few hours in a trap or a few minutes on the end of a drowning slide. Mother nature is great and all but she can also be a cold hard b!tch. Its important to keep in mind that this racoon, if left to a nature, would suffer a slow lingering death compared to a couple of minutes in a tank of water.


One more thing

This response submitted by Brian on 1/4/05 at 2:00 PM. ( ) 67.50.234.207

For any of you aspiring young trappers out there; disregard the above post from Griz. He speaks from a platform of emotion and ignorance. Nothing personal Griz but the only fact I see in your post is the "check your traps daily" part.


Regardless if dogs...

This response submitted by JTM on 1/4/05 at 2:02 PM. ( ) 63.161.168.3

...are not for killing racoons, if the racoon has life left in it when it comes down the tree it is always going to put up a fight and the dogs are going to respond.

The point of my response was not to condone one way of killing an animal over another. I am merely trying to add some perspective to the subject at hand. If you have to take the life of another creature, it seems that it is up to the individual who has to live with that action to do it the way they seem fit.



oh i am sorry i thought JOE was aking for OPINIONS!

This response submitted by Griz on 1/4/05 at 3:19 PM. ( ) 69.66.85.86

maybe i got that from the ..

"Do you feel it is Humain to kill a raccoon by drowning it? Do you feel that is a perfectly resonable way to dispatch it?" ...line in his post.

I didn't see the part that requested facts.

I am sorry i have an opinion and i am sorry i expressed it when it was requested........NOT!


Just because mother nature is cruel don't justify you being cruel.

So according to you all coons are going to die if you don't drown them? I don't think so pal. You can maintain population control without drowning.

And when i coon hunt i don't take shots that are clean and i tie my dog back before i fall the coon.

Don't call me ignorant, i imagine you are an uppity ciityslicker with money and time to kill on the weekends so you mess around in the country on the Saturday and call yourself an outdoorsman.


And for the record JTM i don't think you are the type of coon hunter that i have seen in the past that takes pride in letting the dogs rip up a coon, some go as far as shooting each foot until the coon drops out maimed. I don't think you are like that for a minute, but personally i take the time to tie my dog back, cause it aint the killing that is the sport it is the trailing.


correction....

This response submitted by Griz on 1/4/05 at 3:20 PM. ( ) 69.66.85.86

i dont take shots that *aren't* clean


oh and furthermore....

This response submitted by Griz on 1/4/05 at 3:26 PM. ( ) 69.66.85.86

cecil has the right to the opinion of more easily drowning a mink or muskrat( or whatever he said )than drowning a coon. Don't call him a hypocrit for stating what he feels. That isn't even an opinion. But using that same logic would you eat beef? Ham? Chicken? Dog? Cat? Horse? People? No just cause you eat one type of meat don't mean you treat all meat the same.

And to say cur hasn't ever whacked it? ...Coons of course, he was whacking....coons before most of us knew what a coon was. And one swift blow is all it needs unless you are some sorta cry baby that don't want to get within reach of it, and consider throwing objects at it as whacking it.

Sorry for interrupting on your behalf cur and cecil i know you can stick up for yourself but i was on a roll.


Yes

This response submitted by Brian on 1/4/05 at 4:13 PM. ( ) 67.50.234.207

One swift blow?! Yes, now I'm certain that you are ignorant.


And...

This response submitted by Brian on 1/4/05 at 5:27 PM. ( ) 67.50.234.207

I hate to tell you but every coon I don't drown will indeed die! Pal


YES

This response submitted by tcoop on 1/5/05 at 1:20 AM. ( ) 63.146.104.151

Yes, I feel that drowning is an acceptable and humain method of dispatch.

tcoop


Return to The Taxidermy Industry Category Menu