Sunday morning questions(SMQ's) part 32
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Rick Krane
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« on: October 01, 2006, 12:01:23 AM »

Week 32

Well week 32! How about them mackerel! LOL! Sorry that was in bad taste especially if you dont like mackerel. No more Karma to kick around but we still have a free CD of over 250 of my own personal reference photos top give away! Congratulation to Mr. Marc Vruno of WI!!! Way to go Marc!!!

This week's bonus question is with out photo assistance do to the nature of the question. Good luck on this one! You must participate in answering all the questions to qualify but it is worth sharing your knowledge with every one and you just may win a mega CD set!

I want to personally Thank folks who wrote to me here and personal on my birthday it meant a great deal to me!
I thank you and WASCO for letting me share in my passion "FISH! As long as you keep answering the questions, I will keep writing them.

So with out further ado! Lets Get the morning stared to a new week with some fish taxidermy talk! The good people at WASCO give us the free opportunity here to share information so we can be better-informed taxidermist! So in the spirit of WASCO generosity we share freely with each other!


1.How do you make those dark color markings on the belly of a Brook Trout or on a Smallmouth bass? Tell us how and what you use to make the smoke!

2. How many saltwater fish do you do a year? What are the most common?

3. If you could what would be the one saltwater fish you would love to paint? Why?

4. How do you come up with the angle for setting eyes? What do you use for a guild

5. When it comes to salt water fish over several feet long do you still price by the inch?

6. Have you ever done any free fish mounts? If yes do you do them yearly as part of your business and who would get a free fish mount from you?

7. If your business went to 100% reproductions would you still need a taxidermy license?

8. Would you still be considered a taxidermist if you only did reproductions or would you be like a wood carve who replicates fish? What are your thoughts?

9. Fill in the blank This next year I will make a point of..?

Bonus Question 10

10. Name the types of swimming that fish do? List at least 3 fish from the 3 (hint) categories?

Give it a shot!
 
Any one who emails me personally with the answers will get a few free reference photos from my personal collection. I still want you to answer here so other can benefit form your input on this topic line.

It is all because of you and your awesome replies this has become so successful!
From beginners to the seasoned pro's every one contributes and all benefit from your great experiences! Let see if I we can get more responses on the forum as well as in my email. I will give you some free fish reference photos for the asking just for contributing! As always I just think your answers are so good more and more contribute on here for all see!
My Best and have fun with this!

Rick Krane
Anglers Artistry
312 Chesterfield Rd
Hinsdale, NH 03451
603.336.7296


« Last Edit: October 03, 2006, 09:01:43 AM by Rick Krane » Logged

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Bruce Foster
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« Reply #1 on: October 01, 2006, 12:58:43 AM »

Wow Rick......I can't believe you did this!..........wonderful change for the two or three guys that do repo's

1.  I use an alcohol lamp in lue of paint and steel wool......a soot deposit is applied once I have blocked in my color base coats.....this is easily removed from the hight spots with a fan brush, paper towel and compressor air depending on the species of fish.....for rough scaled fish liked Striped Bass, a fan brush is a good choice....and for fine scaled fish like Tuna, I use air  and my finger.......it is then flashed in with clear laquer

2. 125-175........Broadbill Swordfish, Marlin, Tuna, Dolphin, Stiped Bass, Cobia, Amberjack, Red Drum.......smaller species include Weakfish, Speckled Trout and Spadefish.......there are always some new species

3. Orange Roughy........because it is a deep water fish, that has a life span of 150 years, and doesn't breed untill 25-30 years old.......they are a very beautiful fish

4. Saltwater fish, and particuarly the pelagics, have eyes unlike fresh water fish......and when you mold fish, you can rotate the eye and duplicate that in the molding process.....there is no guess work

5. Yes......from the tip of the tail to the lower jaw...in billfish, I do not include the bill

6. Yes.......two or three times a year.......and I get the fish

7. In Maryland, and if you mold fish, yes.......once you take possesion of the actual fish, you need a licence

8. It doesn't matter to me what I am considered......you can call it what you want....the cliche "TAXI SKIN" is getting old

9. Getting married to Piggy(superpig).......I hope you read this Piggy

Bonus Question: I won't answer that, but can give some hints
Fusiform - torpedo shaped like sharks and barracuda
Laterally compressed - flattened on both sides like angelfish and butterfly fish
Dorsoventrally compressed - flattened top to bottom like skates and rays
Attenuated - slender, round body like the moray eel

thanks again Rick for the opportunity to post after week 31.....I have not done a skin mount in 20+ years
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Ken D
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« Reply #2 on: October 01, 2006, 01:13:23 AM »

1.How do you make those dark color markings on the belly of a Brook Trout or on a Smallmouth bass? Tell us how and what you use to make the smoke!
Paynes Gray . IMHO I think its a little different from a brookie to a smallmouth. On the Brookie, I start with super low pressure and almost wide open spray to stipple the smoke...makes tiny dots all bunched together in a mass. Ive use a brush st stiple before too.I like painting brookies!

2. How many saltwater fish do you do a year? What are the most common?
I did about 75mostly big bull redfish and speckled trout...a few big gamefish reps.

3. If you could what would be the one saltwater fish you would love to paint? Why?
 Really any bright colored reef fishI love the tropical varieties. I used to dive a lot in the Persian Gulf where the water is extremely warm and there are a lot of brilliantly colored fish on the reefs. I would like to do a group of Butterfly fish.

4. How do you come up with the angle for setting eyes? What do you use for a guild
Honestly, I dont use math thereI use reference and I eyeball it. Sorry.

5. When it comes to salt water fish over several feet long do you still price by the inch?
Not reallyI have slot prices anyway.

6. Have you ever done any free fish mounts? If yes do you do them yearly as part of your business and who would get a free fish mount from you?
When I was in business full time, I did a few charity events...thats pretty much it..

7. If your business went to 100% reproductions would you still need a taxidermy license?
If they bring in the real fish to custom mold...then yes.

8. Would you still be considered a taxidermist if you only did reproductions or would you be like a wood carve who replicates fish? What are your thoughts?
My thoughtsa little of both I guess.

9. Fill in the blank This next year I will make a point of..?
Being more tolerant of Cecilseriously, I would try to do more for others who want to learn this craft. Thats why I started Taxidermy in Focus.

Bonus Question 10

10. Name the types of swimming that fish do? List at least 3 fish from the 3 (hint) categories?
Sustained Cruising, Prolonged, Burstnot sure I understand the second partI suppose a tuna would fall into would into the sustained cruising category, maybe salmon into the prolonged and a gar or bass might fall into burstalthough I think many fish might fall into more than one category.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2006, 09:17:58 AM by fishwork » Logged

Mark V.
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« Reply #3 on: October 01, 2006, 01:44:16 AM »

1. I use either airbrush or paintbrush for the markings on the belly of a brook trout or a combination of both. For the smoke color on a smallmouth I use airbrush and blend to desired color depending on the customers reference or my own reference photos.

2. Not many maybe 3-5 saltwater a year tops. I have done Tarpon,Marlin,Sailfish,Wahoo,Speckled trout,Snapper,Halibut,Durado,Stripped bass,bonita and others. Most recently I did a Tuna and tarpon.

3. I would like to do one of those Roosterfish sometime. They are kind of cool looking.

4. I determine the angle I set an eye by what the fish is doing or the position the fish is in. I usually set all my eye after the fish is dry and sealed.

5. I do still charge by the inch from the tip of the jaw following the belly to the tip of the tail.

6. Yes I have done free fish mounts such as a fishing contest for hadicap kids my uncle used to hold. I have also done free mounts for lodges in Canada we used to deal with .

7. I believe you would if you posess the fish for casting purposes. I hope someday my work will be 100% replica fish.

8. Technically I believe you are no longer considered a taxidermist but because you are making representations of fish and still molding and casting from the actual fish I would consider a person a taxidermist. One of the replica venders I use for my blanks told me he has never mounted a fish conventionally in his life LOL.

9.Trying to Like doing deerheads instead of fish as I would much rather do a dozen fish than one deerhead LOL.

10. It's late and really don't understand the question. Like I said some of these boggle me to the point of a headache. Some real good ones though this week Rick, Thanks for all the questions. I always look forward to everyones responses. Love the pumpkin Bruce very creative and my kids sure got a kick out of it.

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Frank E. Kotula
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« Reply #4 on: October 01, 2006, 06:53:10 AM »

1.How do you make those dark color markings on the belly of a Brook Trout or on a Smallmouth bass? Tell us how and what you use to make the smoke!
There are a few way of doing this. One you can do it with powders only , or paint it in. The other is doing both which I like. To get a range on looks dry pigments and powders.

2. How many saltwater fish do you do a year?  Two is general
What are the most common? Sharks

3. If you could what would be the one saltwater fish you would love to paint? Any tropical salt water
 Why? Just their colors

4. How do you come up with the angle for setting eyes?
What do you use for a guild? Two answer this in one and my own best way is this. You must have your base work done, Set the fish up in the angle it's going to be in, then a-line the eyes to the subject. This is how I like to set them when I show students.

5. When it comes to salt water fish over several feet long do you still price by the inch? Generally speaking yes but I don't really get them that big cause of costs LOL.

6. Have you ever done any free fish mounts?  OH YES.........
If yes do you do them yearly as part of your business and who would get a free fish mount from you?
When it comes to kids and helping the less unfortunate I love to help out as much as I can.

7. If your business went to 100% reproductions would you still need a taxidermy license?
No there is no such thing as calling reproductions taxidermy. If that was so then all of those ceramic fish people out there better watch out. Aren't they doing a reproduction of a fish?

8. Would you still be considered a taxidermist if you only did reproductions or would you be like a wood carve who replicates fish? What are your thoughts?
NO. Taxidermy means taxing the skin on a form etc. When our state had this for the test (that you can use a re pro for the test) I fought hard to explain that it should not be in there. All reproductions do is show you the person can or can't paint. Where is the taxidermy in this.
I enjoy re pro's so MPF on this is no way in heck taxidermy. It's an art only.

9. Fill in the blank This next year I will make a point of..? To fill out my paper work so at the end of the year I don't have to do it in a week LOL.

Bonus Question 10

10. Name the types of swimming that fish do? List at least 3 fish from the 3 (hint) categories?
Wow this is tough one here. This is my thoughts and there going to be real different  ???

Ray finned or bonyfish, Toadfish

Cartilaginous fishes Sharks or rays

Lobe finned fish guppies.



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Frank E. Kotula
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Buck...Black Forest Eyes
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« Reply #5 on: October 01, 2006, 07:00:51 AM »

Good Morning Fish Heads ! and Many thanks to you Rick ! Can I play Too?
Ready or not here we go !

1. First I grab the my Custom (Jap) Airbrush with a custom needle. 2.Mix up my Candy-Flip-Flop with a Green Base-coat.+ I use my Pics to make sure that the color is dialed-in!  Start laying my designs in and go only   3r`d  up- "Then I change the color and then  mix my silver metal Pearl.   2. After, I work it to the top.  I do the mottling on the head, and have switched to my 3 rd color by now and have the pattern completly prepped. 3. Then I go over with a deluted mix of Bl-Green Flip-Flop and Mist over the points of intrest that I want to Highlite  4  .Do My Tipping .    .Slap  TINA TURNER  (Simply the Best) ! in the Sterio...Then Start Doing What I Do Best !..
  Clear Coat.... Bring that baby out in the sun and watch the Magic !

2. I looked in the books on this one  SailFish- Sharks-Tuna     I Turned about 137 to date.

3. Sail Fish Tail-Walker Full Mount. With lots of Flip-Flop and Candy !

4.Now would be a good time to tell the folks See My Video that were going to shoot !

5.By the Job ! 1.on Papier..2.Deposit..3.Deliver ON TIME....Ca-Ching $

6. I make Half-casts, and give them for FREE to my customers,  They have my Info on the back and make a great  collectables !  I have Pike -Bait fish  Walleye Rainbow- Brook- Brown-  Carp and even the Grass to place under the Fish so the guys can Build  scenes as they go.. ! I have guys just buy them cuz the look great on the wall as they are .

7.No

8.Be Called an Artists .

9. 1.  Tell my Wife and Kids that I Love them more often !  Get that Video shot about setting my NEW Fish Eyes that we were talking about !  Get WASCO to sell my Eyes !   Go to the Reno Show !.... Man I got lots to do !.....

10. Fish Swim in....Water...Up-Stream...Down-Stream...and in my Shop on the Wall......I Swear That One Moved !...

Thanks Rick....Now I Can Start My Day !

Buck...Black Forest Eyes.com
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Dondi
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« Reply #6 on: October 01, 2006, 07:18:16 AM »

Rick, Great job on that Brook trout you posted, a few threads back !

6. Have you ever done any free fish mounts? If yes do you do them yearly as part of your business and who would get a free fish mount from you?

- I have donated a few Reproductions for a local fishing club contest...for the largest trout caught in a contest. Also, I have given some Replica mounts to a good friend of mine and Son in laws.
7. If your business went to 100% reproductions would you still need a taxidermy license?

- In the state of Ohio, you do not need a "Taxidermist License", therefore you would not need a license for 100% Reproduction fish work either.

8. Would you still be considered a taxidermist if you only did reproductions or would you be like a wood carve who replicates fish? What are your thoughts?

- I do only reproduction fish on a part time basis....30-40 per year. (Also work a Full time Job).  I call myself a "Reproduction Fish Artist", because thats what I am. I have done some skin mounts, but I personally prefer the finished results of a fish that I mold, cast and paint in comparison to a skin mount.
  There is a big difference between ordering a blank from a catalog vs. molding and casting your Replica blank yourself. I think when some Taxidermists state that repro's are easier to do than skin mounts, perhaps they aren't molding and casting their own blanks. So....on a part time basis, I am happy to do repro's, regardless of what title is given.
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Randy Miller
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« Reply #7 on: October 01, 2006, 12:26:13 PM »

1. for smallies, I grind up the softest charcoal pencil I can find (in a sharpener) then just stipple it on with a small stiff brush. I can also then brush it around to blend in. It does'nt leave any sharp outline marks and does not need to be pre-sealed before gloss as graphite and the make-up powders do. Randy
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Evelyn Billington (Superpig)
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« Reply #8 on: October 01, 2006, 04:19:16 PM »

9. Getting married to Piggy(superpig).......I hope you read this Piggy

 ;D Ha ha Bruce, as much as I appreciate the offer I am already spoken for. I think my hubby would have something to say about this. Plus it looks like from your avatar that you are a very messy pumpkin, and having to clean up after you would be a tremendous job which would age me way faster then anticipated :'(. Thank you, but I have to decline the offer. I hope you can find yourself another Pig so you can mark of number 9 on your to do list. :D Still love ya though :-*
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Bruce Foster
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« Reply #9 on: October 01, 2006, 06:07:57 PM »

See Piggy..........if I hadn't forwarned you, you may never have seen it......I could have gotten away with #9.........and since you said I look like your husband, (handsome guy isn't he) and might be his brother, than should I bring Apple or PUMPKIN pie for Thanksgiving?.....make some of those chocolate covered scorpions too.........luv ya to ;D :-* :-* :-* :-* ;D
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Monty
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« Reply #10 on: October 02, 2006, 03:32:51 PM »



1.How do you make those dark color markings on the belly of a Brook Trout or on a Smallmouth bass? Tell us how and what you use to make the smoke! On brookies I have used a stiff bristle brush that I cut off short and stiple the markings. On smallies I have used airbrush(Iwata) by removing the airnozzle to get some spatter and small pieces of sea sponge. An area I am experimenting and trying to improve on. I am sure powders could help here.

2. How many saltwater fish do you do a year? What are the most common? I very rarely do anything saltwater and it is a repro when I do.

3. If you could what would be the one saltwater fish you would love to paint? Why? A french angelfish simply because of their beauty.

4. How do you come up with the angle for setting eyes? What do you use for a guild. Mainly what the fish is doing. I feel I have a better understanding after a recent class I had in New Hampshire.

5. When it comes to salt water fish over several feet long do you still price by the inch? I have not ran into this one.

6. Have you ever done any free fish mounts? If yes do you do them yearly as part of your business and who would get a free fish mount from you? I have done a few for guide groups which I contract. In return, I normally get a free trip or two or some free fish. They also use the fish in outdoor shows which is advertisement for me. My brother or my dad would be the only others.

7. If your business went to 100% reproductions would you still need a taxidermy license? I have to agree that if you take the fish to mold you would need a license. If you ordered them all, you would have to ask conservation officer.

8. Would you still be considered a taxidermist if you only did reproductions or would you be like a wood carve who replicates fish? What are your thoughts? Good question. By the definition of the word, no.

9. Fill in the blank This next year I will make a point of..? Creating a web site, improving my shop and attracting new clients. I will also take the time to study anatomy on a daily basis and strive to improve my work with every fish I mount.

Bonus Question 10

10. Name the types of swimming that fish do? List at least 3 fish from the 3 (hint) categories? Breast stroke, back stroke, and dog paddle. Honestly, I don't know.

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Rick Krane
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« Reply #11 on: October 03, 2006, 09:13:54 AM »

Question 10! This is a tough one! I will give the answer to this one if no one gets it by the end of the week.  Here is a hint... One type are fish you are favorable with by going down to your local fishing hole, the second you would have to spend some time on the big water and the last one you may catch by accident and cut your line but they make great wallets so I hear! I'll give it to the end of the week and then I'll give the answer! OK  A second hint The answer is in how a fish moves while it swims!

My Best!
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AndyO
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« Reply #12 on: October 03, 2006, 03:14:19 PM »

Question 10:

A swimming fish is relying on its skeleton for framework, its muscles for power, and its fins for thrust and direction. Fish shape has a great bearing on ability to move through the water.

A tuna fish which has a fusiform similar to a torpedo can cruise through the water at very high speeds.
 
The attenuated shape of the eel allows it to wiggle into small crevices where it hunts prey. 

The depressed shape of the angler fish is advantageous for its "sit and wait" strategy of hunting.

I did not know this until I did a little research on the Web: http://www.geocities.com/aquarium_fish/how_fish_swim.htm
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"If you are not aware of how bad you suck, you're an idiot."  ~Rick Carter 1-12-12
bigfish90
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« Reply #13 on: October 03, 2006, 05:20:33 PM »

I don't do to many repos and even less saltwater but I'll take a stab at # 10.

Undulatory- Eel and Lampray
Oscillatory- Tuna, Mackerel,Salmon
Lunate-(tail propulsion) Bass,panfish

There is some cross over with many fish but I tried to pick some that use that mode for the most part.
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UFD
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« Reply #14 on: October 05, 2006, 09:45:24 PM »

Yippee, I've caught up on the SMQ's!

1.  I have only done one Brook Trout and that was a long time ago so it doesnt count, but on a Smallmouth for the belly markings I like to use a combination of detailed airbrushing and hand stippling with a bristle type brush using acrylic colors and some hand painting of iridescent colors on the scales over that.  I havent tried it, but I can see where pencils and such would be very useful.

2.  This is kind of a deceptive question from the standpoint of my workload, and here is why.  At least half of the fish that I do are ocean caught salmon, so they are in essence a saltwater phase of a fish that most people consider being from a fresh water riverine environment.   :-\  Most of the saltwater salmon that I do are Chinook, with a few Coho thrown in.

3.  I really dig big chrome fish, so Id love to paint another Tarpon.  The first and only one I did was over ten years ago and I know Id be able to get it a little more realistic today from things Ive learned on saltwater Chinook.

4.  If the fish will be in a habitat setting portrayed as doing something, I try to position the eye at an angle so that it will focused on prey, etc.  Otherwise for a fish on the wall by itself, sometimes I like to roll them down usually no more than about 10-15 degrees, and sometimes to a lesser extent down and forward or down and back.  I dont really use anything for a guide on the angle other than just eyeballing it, or for a specific situation from reference photos of rolled eyes or something Ive personally seen on freshly caught fish as Ive moved them around.

5.  For saltwater phases of coldwater fish (most are over 40) or some of the bottomfish (up to 54) from the Northwest I still go by the inch, but for pelagic fish that I will be ordering a repro for, I usually just figure my costs and add in my fees for assembly and painting and then give a price per fish for that particular project.

6.  I have never done any free fish mounts, but I have cut the price in some situations for a variety of reasons (mostly for advertising and to a lesser extent special circumstances).  I would rather give a little up on a fish here and there and give a variety of folks a special price than to blow it all on just one fish for one person/purpose.

7.  If you were taking possession of a clients fish to make a custom mold/cast of it, you would need a taxidermy license.  Even though our WA taxidermy license is $180, Id most likely still buy one if doing only store bought reproductions, just to err on the safe side.  If you happen to handle a clients fish just to measure it or have parts and pieces of it in your possession, the law basically requires that you have the license, and the repercussions of not having it very well may outweigh the $180 per year.   :-X

8.  I dont think one would technically be called a fish taxidermist if only buying store bought replicas to finish, even though the law may require you to have a taxidermy license if handling or taking possession of a clients trophy for measurements or reference.  I do think that the term fish artist fits very nicely, though, and even when doing any type of fish replicating whether it be fiberglass, urethane, wood, or skin.

9.  This next year I will make a point of trying to get some manner of control over my backlog.  Well, hopefully.   :'(

10. The swimming of most typical fishes can be put into roughly three different categories based upon the degree of curvature that their bodies are put into from the flexing of the body muscles (myomeres) during a sustained or burst swim.  We can split the degree of curvatures into those that exhibit a full wavelength of movement of the body (anguilliform swimming), less than half a wavelength of movement of the body (carangiform swimming) and those of over one half wavelength but less than one full wavelength (subcarangiform swimming).  Carangiform swimming can typically be considered a C-curve position, subcarangiform swimming can be considered to be S-curves, and anguilliform swimming would be a radical S-curve position.  Most fish undertaking a turn will exhibit swimming that is very much like carangiform swimming.  There are some very specialized types of swimming for some species that are described differently, but these three are the main types.

The word anguilliform comes from the anguillidae or eel family, and some examples of that type of swimming are of course lampreys, gunnels, and lungfishes.  True Cod (gadidae) will also exhibit anguilliform swimming when moving slowly.  The word carangiform comes form the carangidae or jack family, and those examples would be jacks, drums, snappers, mackerels, and tuna, with tuna being an extreme enough carangiform swimmer to warrant their own descriptive swimming motion type.  Subcarangiform swimmers are typically fish such as salmon, trout, pike, and bass.

One of the interesting things about anguilliform and subcarangiform swimmers is that the motion of the swimming causes the head to swing from side to side and they thereby effectively eliminate the blind spot towards the rear that most fish have.
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