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Discussion in 'Tanning' started by redwolf, Feb 19, 2009.
I think so to...
I think he was being witty. I hope he was, because everyone knows sodium bicarbonate and baking soda are the same. Our on site Chemist Cyclone here has proven it.
ROFLMAO! YEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS HE was JOKING!
what ever you use you can have slippage problems litan,, krowtann,, all of em...Its not the liquids fualt, as the skins had problems before entering the mix if ya ask me,,,cuz recently I have tanned fox, bobcats sheep marmots etc etc without loosing a hair.... :-\
Ron, in my house we call it "the luck of Greenwood" If I have anything to do with it, something will go wrong. :-\
I dont use it anymore but the stuff(Krowtann really locked the hair good for me)
a little stop-rot is always a good idea guys also
and you can call McKenzie for JRTS -quart ask for # 475468
-gallon # 475469
GREAT PRODUCT (you know who i mean)somewhere off in the distance a deer grunted lmao
I would like to know what "hard chemicals" you expect to remove with a carbon filter.
Bob, If you're that sure fired that it was your water, then try some distilled water. Nothing in there to blame.
Whenever I see "followed to the T"...I raise an eyebrow...How did you handle the hides before the "T"? ...and please explain the steps you took towards and through your "T"...
Thinking he might've made a wrong turn at that "T"? LOL, I had this vision of tanning and ending up at a "T" in the road, not knowing which way to turn, maybe it's to the BS or is it to the S of B?
Red, I'd try it on a scrap with distilled water like Cyclone suggested. I'd almost bet something else went wrong somewhere unless it is the water. KT usually locks the hair tight, I've used it on some pretty iffy stuff, and NOT always with Stop Rot. I was afraid our pH would be too high, even called OW and they said it shouldn't be a problem and it wasn't. The reason I was worried about it was because I always had a hard time getting Safety Acid at the right pH, always had to add way more than the instructions called for.
Foxes are the worst animals to slip...regardless of how they are handled. That slippage on the face looks suspiciously like an area that blood pooled prior to skinning. What is the history on that fox Bob?
cyclone, ummm like chlorine, humm...... makes one wonder......yea Bob that would be better, truck your distilled water in or keep going back and forth spending more to tan a hide then sending it out for tanning thats a better idea??? But I meant "hard" water.
I've never seen chlorine classified as "a hard chemical"..and...ummm, you supported the use of clorox in pickles in another post...
makes one wonder....
Yea and look who backed me up.... Monty. here this is for you. http://www.quantumbalancing.com/charcoal_water.htm
But you know more then him.
In order to perform an experiment to see if it is indeed the water, he'd only need bout 3 gallons from the grocery store...but my money is on that it's not his water...
So which is it, chlorine or none? I know what charcoal filters remove....I was wondering where the "hard chemical" classification comes from...
Now the banana vinegar part was interesting...
I was just making a suggestion that I did not think it was the water, and that's where we are now, you saying you don't think it's the water. you don't like the fact you can use bleach in a pickle, well sorry but you can, I have done it many time as most real tanneries do. then you want to know what hard chem's are in water so I show you,but you don't think they are hard enough. then you say the bleach is wrong, but I show you a quote from monty who we have respect for, and you still argue. so sir as redwolf say's .....thick skin, thick skin, I need to walk away from this one I don't want to argue. have a good night sir oooops forgot http://www.epa.gov/opp00001/factsheets/chemicals/chlorinedioxidefactshee
god bless ya
Then it makes no sense to remove it with a charcoal filter....
OK, now I see where you are going with this. You think I am contradicting myself. No sir, I am not. OK, you said what hard chemicals are in water, I just named one as you asked. Then I gave you a link to find many more. So when you say which one is it, you want to know, do I or don't I use bleach? Well with Krowntan, I would never! As it is a pickle and a tan in one with pre tan and I am pretty sure pre tan is BASCAL-S and that WILL make for a strong gas. But will I or will I not use bleach in a pickle, yes if I wanted to keep using that pickle I would. But If I was tanning a deer in formic acid, say I have 10 gal water and I wash 3 deer capes, I will start with a pH of 1.5, that's as low as I can get with my tap water, unless I want to run a reverse osmosis system and I don't. I have but I don't now. Well my pH would be about 4 the next day with the formic absorption into the skin. So I would pull my capes add my lutan-f and tan them in that same solution. If you want to know why I will PM you. I do not just through crap in the wind to see if it will come back and hit me. I only say what I know to work very good for me and try to share it. I am sorry if you think I am a know it all, I don't try to come off as one. I have made a living from taxidermy and spent as many hours experimenting with trial and error as doing the taxidermy it's self. I just try to help people with what I have learned, and tanning is one thing I spent many many hours learning, so if I can save people the error part of what I did I will try to do so. But I really don't want to argue with anyone. If you guy's would rather me just not say any thing or post any tutorials then PM me and tell me.....I will stop then. Thank you Dave
Joey, I got 4 fox from a guy that had them trapped and kept live. He watched them get dispatched and they were put directly in a freezer.
Like I said I did 2 of them, and the first one was fine with no slipping at all. Then this one went bad.
Cyclone IF I decide to give it another try I'll get some distilled water.
I have the other 2 fox caped out and in a tan right now. I hope they come out OK.
When I said "to a T" I meant I skinned, turned and fleshed the same way I've done it for years, and I followed the directions that came with the Krowtann.
No extra this or that.
It looks real simple to me, you left it int he neutralizing to long. or your sodium bicarb was a bit to strong.
Water does make a huge difference!!!! Here our water is hard, real hard, right out of the limestone. even a pets water dish after just a couple days can have calcium buildup.
Now the reason I say its over neutralized, is I have red fox skins in Krowtann now going on two years and they are fine, bobcat skins too. Took a couple out last week and did final fleshing and neutralizing ont hem and they are fine.