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Discussion in 'Tanning' started by Rhino, Mar 8, 2009.

  1. stuffenstuff

    stuffenstuff Member

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    Re: A little secret about tanning oils

    I'm starting to miss him... :(....
     
  2. Randy Mac

    Randy Mac New Member

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    Re: A little secret about tanning oils

    I did not think he would answer it with the answer that all of us would like to here from him. I would not answer it myself!! I would like to say I have not found as good of oil to use on a wet tan cape as the 750.
     

  3. stuffenstuff

    stuffenstuff Member

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    Re: A little secret about tanning oils

    I love the 750 also...and my price :)
     
  4. psycho

    psycho 2011 WORLD CHAMPIONS!

    Re: A little secret about tanning oils

    Pro Plus oil you mix at a 1 to 2 ratio. 1 part oil two parts hot tap water. Works very well. A quart of oil last a long time. Dan
     
  5. Gunner1

    Gunner1 New Member

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    Re: A little secret about tanning oils

    750 has an activity of 82%-83%.
     
  6. Monte

    Monte Missouri fur-Limited hair-tanning

    Re: A little secret about tanning oils

    I am confused, is 750 and 850 knobloch products?
     
  7. stuffenstuff

    stuffenstuff Member

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    Re: A little secret about tanning oils

    Yea, from what I am understanding it is Knobloch number 1 and number 2 as a wholesale.
     
  8. Gunner1

    Gunner1 New Member

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    Re: A little secret about tanning oils

    Knobloch's mixes the oils, they are purchased upline from suppliers that sell individual ingredients. Knoblochs blends the mixes and then resells a unique blend that IMO is better than the basic upline supplier product. BASF, TFL, Atlas, etc. can be contacted, but then you have to experiment with the products to achieve your own blend. McKenzie, Knoblochs, and other suppliers have spent many, many years and dollars to achieve their brand blends.

    Retails as #1 and #2, Wholesales as 750 Special and 850 Special
    100H is 69-70% Activity
    200H is 73-74%
    200SF is 89-90%
    300H is 80-81%
    300 SFS is 97-98%
    500 is 89-90%
    750 is 82-83%
    Then you start getting into White oils and Fatliquors

    How you use each oil and how you mix the oils with other solvents and/or water is strictly proprietary and requires lab experimentation before using in a full production run.
     
  9. bowhuntnnut

    bowhuntnnut 210-260-0190

    Ok what the he(( whas that about?? ???
     
  10. Gunner1

    Gunner1 New Member

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    More Knobloch products from their price list.
     
  11. Para soft is an oil and in the way of activity no its not 100 %
    All the other oils Gunner listed are knoblochs WHOLESALE products.
    They all have there place in tanning but most have no real use to a taxidermist tanning his own skins,
    Some give the skin a drier feel ,others may be good for wetter feel and the list is endless and takes thousands of dollars and hours to
    figure their use,its what the person tanning is looking for in finished skin.
    There aren't any magic products that let your skins come out like the pros just by apply them. What works for one persons tanning may never work for another
    person very well. Your methods, shaving, moisture content at time of oiling, type of tan, time ran, timing when drummed, humidity, even the condition before receiving
    the skin, they all add up in th end ! Years of experience tell you how to handle whats in front of you.
    That all being said as a taxidermist doing your own tanning theres nothing you cant achieve with Rittels and Knobochs #1 oils .
    You may have to tweak with it for your process, but they will give excellent results.
    The only constant for sure I know about tanning is that its a hell of a lot of work to do right ! ;D
     
  12. Gunner1

    Gunner1 New Member

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    Right on Fishslayer. The 100% activity would be an extremely heavy oil. I would think that parasoft would be fine for practical purposes in taxidermy. Knobloch's has an all in one tan and oil called Liquatan that should simplify things even more.

    BNB , If the issue is shrinkage, thin the leather more. What you can't get with a machine, try getting with a skife knife or scalpel on a ball bat.
     
  13. bowhuntnnut

    bowhuntnnut 210-260-0190

    Trust me it's not the thinning. I'm no pro but I can shave. Gunner I sent you a pm describing the problem. I really think it's a fixation issue, but I'm still running some experimental batches.
     
  14. Gunner1

    Gunner1 New Member

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    Check the ionic charges between your tan that is giving you issues and the oil you are using. They need to be opposite or at the very least multicharged for good fixation.
     
  15. Rhino

    Rhino Too many irons in the fire will put the fire out!

    Gunner, why did you edit your flatulence?

    At first, you knew what kind of oil my employer used, and then you said, it was substandard?

    I didn't bite, your trying to provoke an argument, then you changed your face? What gives?

    What a dip5hit! All the submersible tans out there AVAILABLE TO TAXIDERMISTS, are cationic, SO THEREFORE MOST, IF NOT ALL THE OILS, ARE GOING TO BE anionic.

    http://www.iultcs.org/leather_terms/f.asp Scroll down to fat liquior/liquoring. Any time you mix an oil with water, you are fat liquoring. Only kicking GREASE, has an activity of 100%.

    White oil, that is water soluble, is also, a FAT LIQUOR.

    The activity of an oil, has little to do with its VISCOSITY. The difference between a synthetic oil, with an activity of 85%, that pours like buttermilk, and a 100% oil, is hard for the naked eye, to tell the difference.

    It has taken gunner1, close to 3 years, to make 20 something posts. Don't even try that, Ive been in Iraq BS! That makes you even more of a low life!

    You pull out the gunner1 face, when your own face, cant stand the heat, just to start trouble. I would hate to know that I had that little of a life, as to keep a password, and name, around, for close to 3 years, just to remain anonymous. Be a man!
     
  16. Gunner1

    Gunner1 New Member

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    Hunh? I never been to Iraq. I edited to help you duck out. But now your back starting trouble.

    The oils available on market today and are paired with the suppliers tans are not meant to be cut. I agree with your statement that the high activity means it can be cut, but why would I want to tinker with an oil to stretch it even if I am trying to save money? What are you bringing viscosity up for? I thought you meant to instruct guys on activity.
    Out of my list of oils, most are anionic as you say, but here are the rest that are non-ionic or multicharged:
    100H - anionic
    200H - anionic
    200SF - anionic
    300H - anionic/cationic
    300SFS - anionic-non-ionic
    500 - multicharged
    750 - anionic
    Diasyntan -multicharged fatliquor
    KG-244 - neutral

    What is your point? I guess I am not following you. I got into 1 argument with you in September 2007 when I had come back from overseas and you are still cussing me? I never said where I was. If you want to know, I was working in the leather industry in Greece and Germany. I have a working knowledge of tanning and I took issue with you once. Shame on me.

    I just think your dry tans are inferior and that goes back to the oil you use. That is my opinion. That is what I think. Bash me if you want to, but not everyone thinks you have the best product.
     
  17. stuffenstuff

    stuffenstuff Member

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    I've had words with oldshaver in the past, even though, I have to say I have a good deal of respect for him and his opinion. He is a man that will tell you what he thinks and has an enormous amount of pride in his work, that's hard to find today.....I am not taking side's as I don't even know Gunner1, but form what I read I think you both have a great deal of tanning knowledge and hope people appreciate what they can learn from you guys. The last thing I would want to see is one of you guys stop posting! It would only hurt us that like to keep learning,
    I do wonder how anyone would know what kind of oil oldshaver use's? He will not even tell..... LOL Just try to remember it's only about the tanning not the people, arguments are good, they help let people look at both side's. God knows I get in my share of them!
    I guess what I am asking is could you guy's shake, hug,or whatever, so WE can benefit from both your guy's GREAT deal of tanning knowledge!...Please ;D
     
  18. Gunner1

    Gunner1 New Member

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    I'm good. I guess I should have left him out of my comments and just stuck to the info presented. Sorry oldshaver. I know folks who have been to his tannery and told me bits and pieces of his process. I guess I got a little too gabby. My mistake. No harm meant.