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Please stop patronizing the beginners

Discussion in 'The Taxidermy Industry' started by George, Oct 1, 2009.

  1. LordRusty

    LordRusty If I agreed with you, we'd both be wrong.

    5,573
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    Yeah, and when I get "brutally honest" I get crucified for it! I'm not an kisser, never was, never will be. And because of the way those of you who praise George for being brutally honest then crucify me for doing the exact same thing ... what the hell do YOU want? Make up your minds!

    You either want honesty or you don't! And that goes across the board ... for beginners and so called "talented artists" ... being brutally honest should be equal.

    No one learns from not being told what's wrong with a piece ... they just keep repeating the same mistakes.

    Yeah, I can be harsh, but so does George. But when George says something that sounds like it comes out of my mouth, it's "Oh listen to George, he knows this and that ..." Then if I say something that sounds like pearls of wisdom from George it's "Why are you always so negative!"

    You can't have it both ways. I agree with George here on this item. I've seen lauded as the next Akeley mount ... for crying out loud! Stop worrying about feelings being hurt, or bruised egos ... that's life. You don't always get what you want, and if you can't face it ... well, you know the option! There's so much kissing going on, the brown noses are showing.

    If a mount has flaws, then let the person know ... then let them know how they can improve their work for the next time.

    I'm not advocating "Man, that sucks!" as a form of critique because it is not ... just as I'm not advocating "Oh, that's awesome!" just so feelings don't get hurt!

    There is constructive criticism, and outright meanness, although sometimes some on here can't tell the difference.

    And Kerby .... JEEZE MAN! Take it away! My eyes! :eek: :eek: :eek: LOL!

    John.
     
  2. Uncle Harley

    Uncle Harley New Member

    I see your point John, but the only time I have seen people jump you( but I don't see all your posts) was on game head of the week were it specifically says " this is a critique free zone" and that is the only place on here where people are getting smoke blown up there ass where in MY opinion it is OK because you don't normally see "great mount" directed to anyone unless it is. If it sucks it gets no comments...........but if they ask for it..................I say let em have it ;)
     

  3. michael p.

    michael p. Getting better with age :)

    Look Marsh Master, we're brothers!
     
  4. Uncle Harley

    Uncle Harley New Member

    one with ADD and the other with OCD LOL
     
  5. Cole

    Cole Amateur Taxidermist

    Lord Rusty, the difference between George and you, is George doesn't treat people like dirt. He doesn't go off the deep end, throwing F-Bombs left and right at people, he doesn't tell them they are worthless, and he doesn't degrade them like you do. When someone asks for a critique, that's one thing, but if they don't ask, you should just keep your mouth shut. The things I've seen you say and do to others on here are not even in the same ballpark as the stuff George says. I'd show some examples, but you're so vulgar they always get zapped.
     
  6. Mr.T

    Mr.T Active Member

    Ok, my turn, let me have it. :)
     
  7. Uncle Harley

    Uncle Harley New Member

    You were one of the holes!!!!!!!!!!!!!....................................that helped me out by being honest too Thanks! LOL
     
  8. LOL....Hell George it would probably look better than your last.......geeze.....who crapped in your oatmeal this morning.......lol

    But then again I kinda agree with you. I don't think the novice should be whacked in the head with a dull axe.....but , true, he doesn't need the rose enema either. Somewhere in the middle accompanied with good advise would be in order. :)
     
  9. txoutdoors

    txoutdoors Active Member

    I remember my first post. Got the same BS as most people.....looks good for the first... blah blah blah. Then George commented and was brutally honest. I will be the first to admit that I didn't like what he said because I was proud of what i had done, but......it drove me to try to prove him wrong. It made me look deeper into reference and EVERYTHING he pointed out i was extra sensitive to on the next. I was not going to have him say that about my work again.

    I did a bird with both wings partially opened. He told me that a duck would not be positioned like that and that it looked like an angina. I was really po'ed and set out to prove him wrong. I remember looking at hundreds of photo's hoping to find 1 that i could throw back at him. After hours of research, I realized that I was wrong and it's best to listen to those with experience.

    Bottom line....although his honesty may have ruffeled my feathers, it made me work harder and use more reference. Looking back, I appreciate his honesty.

    Thanks George!
     
  10. AFWS

    AFWS The lost Robertson

    Whatcha sayin George? your work sucks or you need a critique :D Michael P when did you become a beginner? I thought you waz the TOP dawg ;D
     
  11. RDA

    RDA Active Member

    I will say this be carefull watcha wish for...... ;D
     
  12. AFWS

    AFWS The lost Robertson

    I don't wish whatcha talkin about? ok maybe a little ;D bass boat,trip to Africa(to hunt), and to get really good at painting fish ;D
     
  13. redwolf

    redwolf Active Member

    I don't care if it does piss some people off if I tell someone their first looks better than mine did. If it is better I'm gonna say it.
    I wont blow smoke either, I give a critique of what I have learned through experience. My critique may not be as good as someone elses but I'll still give it.
     
  14. redwolf

    redwolf Active Member

    Also Kirby, you say "But I choose to not give my critique unless they ask it privately (my choice). There is a place to point out the positives and the negatives on a mount."
    I disagree. Beginners look at other peoples first mounts and see the advice that was given. They can use the same advice, but if it's not there on the forum they will never know what they could have known if it was posted for the public to see.
     
  15. Kerby Ross

    Kerby Ross KSU - Class of '83; U.S. Army - Infantry (83-92)

    Choices....

    Redwolf, I have given out critiques in the past on these taxi.net forums and then spent numerous posts defending my comments. Not doing it anymore.

    :)

    Kerby...
     
  16. redwolf

    redwolf Active Member

    You shouldn't have to defend anything. If you ask me THAT'S what we should be bitching about.
    If someone wants to use Krowtann LET EM, if someone wants to use gas LET EM. If it works for them the rest should shut up. It isn't effecting me or the way I do things.
     
  17. If you can't handle the answer, don't ask the question!!!
     
  18. George

    George The older I get, the better I was.

    ROTFLMAO txoutdoors . The bird looked like an ANHINGA. I don't know what an "angina" looks like but I'll bet Michael does. LMAO
     
  19. John L

    John L Active Member

    Got to go with George on this one. I didn't learn much until people stop being nice and got real. Real does not equal REAL MEAN. Real means critiquing a piece as if it were your own. What is wrong, why it is wrong, and how to fix it. How do you get the natural rolled crease in an eyelid so it is soft and doesn't look tooled. This may be something better taught or learned at a show but CONSTRUCTIVE criticism should be just that.

    Looks ok, good, or nice start in some cases is just a nice way of saying there is so much wrong we don't know where to start or we don't want to start a yelling whining thread.

    John
     
  20. coonhollow

    coonhollow Active Member

    I'm somewhat new here as far as Taxinet goes but started doing taxidermy in 1987-88 I trained with a lot of people, many top taxidermist for their era. I attended shows, competitions , workshops, and without taking my mounts there for someone to tear apart and tell me what was really wrong with them i would have been at a stalemate with my work. Ralph Garland would give you a score sheet for everything you did at Piedmont College he would nit pick everything and go over it with you in detail that's when I really caught on. I never competed with Whitetails just because I knew I wasn't there yet they are the hardest category as far as I'm concerned but I did have some critiqued along the way and without that again I would be at a stalemate within my work. I was a very impatient person years ago! if I couldn't achieve where i wanted to be I would pack up and go work with someone for a few days, a week etc..I wish this site was here back then new or old taxidermist can gain from this site. even the ones on here that have taken top awards can better themselves here. "Every Taxidermist" has their week areas, birds, fish, reptiles whatever. So the ones patting themselves on the back every day when they get up need a wake up too. Take your worst area in taxidermy and compete in those categories? it wont happen with some because it would tarnish their name to do lesser quality work.
    I like to joke around on this site like most and there are some great people here that do not know me but people that I respect and like just from their words here.
    I would help anyone interested in taxidermy just because I know what it was like 20+ years ago when it was a "secret art" and nobody was willing to help. If a new person asks for everyones opinion then people should be honnest and give it to them. just because you are setting behind a keyboard and have more stones than you would with someone face to face leave the rudeness out of it!
    George what do you think about making up a scoresheet on here so that when people truly want opinion's they can get it in a form that would benefit them? make sure everyone provides x amount of photos for everyone to use.
    I'm willing to help anyone all they have to do is ask I no longer do commercial work and focusing on the 2011 world show as well as other taxidermy related things.