1. Welcome to Taxidermy.net, Guest!
    We have put together a brief tutorial to help you with the site, click here to access it.

Questions regarding purchase of antique mounts

Discussion in 'Bird Taxidermy' started by Gibson21, Aug 29, 2010.

  1. George

    George The older I get, the better I was.

    I suppose it's inevitable that some social wonder wants to reinvent the wheel. Some 50 years ago, likely before you were born, an idiot taxidermist named Lanny Ballard conned the NTA into spending about $3 million into fighting the government to "overturn this silly law". It went through the courts and after exhausting most of the NTA treasury, the government blinked and WE WON. Along with the win, the US Dept. of Interior issues ONE PERMIT TO LANNY BALLARD FOR ONE FRIGGIN HAWK.
    The world today is much different from that of half a century ago. With political correctness, animal rights groups, "save the soecies" groups, "environmentalists, and just plain bunny huggers, we were simply trying to educate you that the wheel has already been discovered.
    Still, what do I know. Your first step should be to contact the US Fish and Wildlife Service. There are offices in every region of the country. In Delaware mine is in Newtown, Massachusetts. Their phone is (413) 253-8200. Call them and ask to speak to an agent. Ask the agent for the specific CFR
    I suppose I shouldn't be surprised when some social warrior decides that the wheel needs to be reinvented. We were simply trying to tell you that you aren't the first and simply because we find no reasoning in it or thing it's a senseless requirement doesn't change the matter. It's been almost 50 years since and idiot taxidermist named Lanny Ballard convinced the NTA to challenge the USFWS. After spending nearly $3million carrying the issue through the courts, the NTA WON!!! Then Lanny Ballard was issued a permit for ONE FRIGGIN HAWK. About 10 years ago, for some harebrained reason, Ballard was presented the Pioneer Award for that idiocy and in his acceptance speech he encouraged us that we should revisit this and fight that "senseless law".

    SO, far be it from me to stop someone's manifest destiny. Understand that before you embark on this journey, you're going to be battling the animal rights activists, the environmentalists, and the bunny huggers as well as the bean counting bureaucrats who oppose any changes to the laws. First step is to contact your REGIONAL USFWS office. In Delaware, mine is in Newtown, Massachusetts (413) 253-8200. When you speak to an agent, beware of any benevolence. If he says the issue is fine, then you get a name and a date and an office title of the person. If he declines, as him exactly what CFR (Code of Federal Regulations - I'm presuming it's the CFR 50-10 series) covers the issue you've raised. Then you must sit down and send a letter requesting a variance to the CFR with all this information to the USFWS at your regional office. If they decline, start a package and send your letter and their denial to the USFWS in DC. If that fails, then your next package needs to go to the US Department of the Interior. If that fails, then it's time for the court system to be involved, but you should read a famous quote by Thomas Tusser before you do.
     
  2. Nancy C

    Nancy C Well-Known Member

    Be aware that if you contact the USFW dept that there's a pretty good chance that your mount will be confiscated and you will never see it again. If you are lucky that's all that will happen, but if not then you may end up being fined for illegal possession of a protected species.
    The reason is that all mounts of protected species were supposed to be registered and grandfathered in within a relatively short grace period after the law changed.
     

  3. fish stuffer

    fish stuffer Active Member

    140
    77
    I'm thinking I read somewhere it is "illegal to have in your possession." It's like cocaine, even if you ain't selling it, it's illegal to possess.
     
  4. fish stuffer

    fish stuffer Active Member

    140
    77
    In GA., you can't buy or sell bears, parts, or barter for them. I was in an antique store one time, in Columbia S.C.. I saw a bear rug in an old trunk. "Buy the trunk and the rug goes with it for free. Price on the trunk, 600 bucks. I.m pretty sure that would be bartering.
     
  5. Nancy C

    Nancy C Well-Known Member

    Technically it's illegal, but in the case of an old mount that still has the old style of eyes and the shrunken feet that were typical of mounts 50-some-odd years ago, you *probably* won't get in trouble for it, although a game warden would likely confiscate it if you couldn't produce the paperwork showing that it had been grandfathered in at the correct time.
    Not all of them would; it would be up to the individual, and of course you could also get the other extreme who would decide to throw the book at you for killing that owl.
    (You're guilty until proven innocent, don't ya know?)
     
  6. byrdman

    byrdman Well-Known Member

    6,479
    606
    was remounting an owl a while back and had it in pieces when the warden came over so I showed him the wings tail etc and the old greasy wrapped excelsior body I took out so he says " oh yeah thats that straw stuff they used to use ya you can tell thats pretty old they dont use that stuff anymore" ...... didnt show him the new body I had wrapped
     
  7. byrdman

    byrdman Well-Known Member

    6,479
    606
    Nancy where did you ever hear about " registering" protected mounts after the ban......, all raptors were notbanned at the same time great horned owls remained unprotected for a time after other birds were protected and who/ how was this notification of "registering" suppossed to happen my old owls were inspected by a fed co who is now dead
     
  8. George

    George The older I get, the better I was.

    Byrdman, no one is arguing that he could KEEP the bird that was grandfathered in. What's puzzling is his comments on an auction where the bird is being SOLD.
     
  9. rolandzeke

    rolandzeke New Member

    11
    0
     
  10. rolandzeke

    rolandzeke New Member

    11
    0
    WOW—— you read a lot of stuff into my simple request! First you say “some 50 years ago , likely before you were born” , when I clearly state I am 87 . Then you seen to call me a “social wonder and social warrior “ . I simply wanted to know how ,as I said in my post, to “grandfather “ my owl that I have had for about 60 years. I said it’s too bad the industry didn’t get together and try to fight the goofy laws ,like picking up a eagle or hawk feather makes me a criminal when ,as you say, an animal rights activist,environmentalist or bunny hugger turns me in and costs me a bundle. .
     
  11. Little off topic, but it fits in.
    true story!
    Some 20 something years ago the district , Louisiana wildlife and fisheries education department. Sent their Bald Eagle mount to me to be cleaned and repainted.
    All the paperwork to the bird was attached to the backside of the driftwood it sat on.
    A local cop stopped to check on his deer. He leaves and about an hour later I get a call from my friend in the La. dept. wildlife & fisheries education office. Note> ( same guy that sent the bird) He says Glenn you ain’t gonna believe what just happened.
    We got a call you had a Bald Eagle in your shop. The man over the enforcement devision at the time was also a customer of mine. He calls my friend to his office and tells him about the call that had come in. And that two officers had been dispatched to my location. My friend is in shock and tells him he cant believe I would be that stupid, he dont believe it. He goes back to his office , Thinking on it for a few minutes, it hits him. its THERE EAGLE. He runs down the hall to tell them its the Departments eagle.
    They radioed the officers and turned them around which was less than a mile away.
    Wouldn’t that have been a hellof thing. Going to jail over a bird that belonged to them to start with.

    The cop made the phone call.
     
    jemmick likes this.
  12. byrdman

    byrdman Well-Known Member

    6,479
    606
    oh thought he daid his uncle gave it to him
     
  13. George

    George The older I get, the better I was.

    Oh Roland, please. Your comments have bounced around like a kernel in a popcorn popper. you don't think $3 million was enough? Then why didn't you spend some of your money fighting it and why were you looking for "someone" else to do it for you? Why is my commode tank limited to 3 gallons of water, why did STOP signs get painted red instead of the yellow they'd been for decades, why can't I buy fresh milk, why must I wear seatbelts? It's a damned owl, feather mites have destroyed the original beauty, and here yo are making a Congressional issue of it. Had you just stopped and taken Nancy's advice to begin with, none of this conversation would be happening.

    OH, and by the way, I hope if I get to be 87, I'm still as up-to-date on modern technology as you are. You inspire me (HONESTLY) as sometimes this computer world kicks my ass.
     
    Wildthings likes this.
  14. jemmick

    jemmick Active Member

    670
    75
    WNY
    I remember the whole lannie Ballard issue, and if memory serves me right, the feds went in an confiscated the bird until, after all that money, they gave him the permit. We thought we had victory but alas it will NEVER be . You can't beat city hall or in this case the federal government. It is what it is , we need to pick our battles and as George says not reinvent the wheel. Been there and done that. Enjoy the bird an keep your mouth shut or you may get a visit !!