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Half cast vs form?

Discussion in 'Fish Taxidermy' started by Slick, Apr 23, 2011.

  1. Slick

    Slick Something smells fishy?

    It is 9" from the collarbone to base of tail.
     
  2. Perca

    Perca Well-Known Member

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    I agree that panfish done with the half cast method are very accurate. Cecil Baird is one of our best at doing panfish by that method. I was fortunate enough to learn the method from him. I have also used commercial forms, and I used a lot by Matt Thompson with good results. With that said, I now carve my forms for panfish. With the light density foam, a block can be carved and sanded into a perfectly fitted body in a very short period of time. However, I like to carve bodies simply because I can "enhance" the girth a lot, especially on perch. I think it took me about 15 minutes to carve each of these.

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  3. franchi612

    franchi612 New Member

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    Why not just fill it with wood wool then? Wouldn't that be faster you wouldn't have to do the whole plaster thing. Just wondering. Randy, no question your name does belong up there with all the greats. You doing a half cast is alot different than someone like me lol. I don't know whatever I did, I did it wrong, and I don't catch enough big fish to justify wasting them on failed tries, and I certainly won't chance a customer fish on something I don't know how to do right.
     
  4. "whatever I did, I did it wrong"
    And there we have it folks. That is why people say HC fish are terrible. Because theirs is.
    Wood wool? You really don't want a serious answer do you?
     
  5. Ok George...round 1.
    Now no help from the fishheads...let the old bear do it.
    Here are the pics of my crappy... er I mean Crappie.

    One of these things is not like the others,
    One of these things just doesn't belong,
    Can you tell which thing is not like the others
    By the time I finish my song?

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  6. George

    George The older I get, the better I was.

    Unless you're talking about one being a black crappie and one being a white, I guess we both have an afinity for being too dumb to understand each other. What I DO see is the typical convex contour between the pectoral and anal fins common with many if not most half cast fish. My initial statement was aimed at someone who is NOT Randy B who like all those other guys could pull off world class work using balsa wood if necessary. Some people just have that "magic" while the others like me have to labor at getting something close to being right. I use the most modern methods available since they wouldn't have become "modern methods" without being better in some ways. I need all the help I can get.
     
    JL likes this.
  7. franchi612

    franchi612 New Member

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  8. Randy Miller

    Randy Miller Active Member


    I have to disagree. In the right hands, it certaqinly can. It does take some patience to do. I took a Best of Catagory with one in 2003, used Tom Sexton's fish fill. Won't use any other. Learned from Cecil as well, Perca.
     
  9. George, you are right! Good eye old timer.
    But we are talking about customer mounts AND 1/2 cast vs commercial mannikins...somehow competition keeps on coming up. Yes many talented people can and do win with half casting...but strangely no one is winning anything with commercial mannikins? Can someone with half their talent produce a commercial mount with acceptable results? Yep. As good as commercial mannikins? sure.
    It seems to me that both methods work great for this...and perhaps we both should learn not to speak in "absolutes".
    Just look around you...look throughout he archives and you will see dozens of beginners that are now great at what they do. In some cases one class here or there and BAM! marked improvement. Everyone has the ability to excel at at anything they choose to practice.
    As far as antiquated methods, modern fish fillers aren't that old. Sure "filling" fish with things like vermiculite, perlite, sand etc is. Casting is antiquated too, used to be ceramics and cast iron, now plastics, foams and other polymers are used to vast improvements and new applications. I use mannikins on every bass I mount now. I sure did try the 1/2 cast method, and it didn't work out so good. Was it the fault of the material or the artist? I suspect the latter. But since I got the result I wanted from the mannikin I never again revisited the method to practice it and improve. The difference my friend is that I would never develop the opinion because of MY experience that the method is inferior. It is the artist that is.
    Ron
     
  10. franchi612

    franchi612 New Member

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    yeah you are 100% right bullwhip I am totally inferior and I hope someday my fish will be as good as yours :-X...
     
  11. Thanks,
    But I wouldn't know. You've never posted any pics. :)
     
  12. George

    George The older I get, the better I was.

    I can't disagree with that bullwhip. It just seems that this industry today is comprised of many many more "craftsmen" than "artists" however. I'm one of those and need all the advantage I can get. WASCO sells a classic work by Ruth Sawyer Bullard on Ralph Morrell's Museum Fish Taxidermy and McClane's Standard Fishing Encyclopedia even includes an instructional diagram of simple fish casting that will work well for the half-cast method. I just have to stick with what I'm comfortable with.
     
    JL likes this.
  13. Slick

    Slick Something smells fishy?

    Well now that we have all that out of the way. Can I alter a left turn to be a rIght turn tail out and up. Or should I just get one of the big forms from rinehart and make it smaller.
     
  14. George

    George The older I get, the better I was.

    If Matt Thompson's won't work, it will be easier to alter the Rinehart.
     
  15. Slick

    Slick Something smells fishy?

    Ok, I am thinking of trying to carve a body for this fish. But I don't have any carving foam. But I do have a MT pike form that I cut in half for a half mount pike head. Will this form work for me to carve a body out of it?
     
  16. franchi612

    franchi612 New Member

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    Incorrect.
     
  17. Ok then let me rephrase. I cant find any pics you've posted checking "show the last posts of this person." 15 posts per page, 10 pages.
     
  18. franchi612

    franchi612 New Member

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    um not sure wgere you are looking but this is on the first page of my recent posts
    http://www.taxidermy.net/forum/index.php/topic,260691.msg1823649.html#msg1823649
    If you really want to continue this take it to a pm, because I'm sure I'm not the only one tired of this.
     
  19. franchi612

    franchi612 New Member

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    Possibly. It would depend on if the wood block is still in the mannekin. Sometimes the foam seems a little crumbly too once you take off that outer skin. I don't use many MT forms, so hard for me to say what the foam is like. You can also get foam at alot of home improvement stores. In a pinch, you might be able to use dry floral foam, especially f you can get the grey Oasis foam, but make sure it is not fresh flower foam!
     
  20. You can get 2" foam board at Home Depot in 4'x8' sheets, under $30. Cut them to rough shape, glue them together if you need them thicker, and start cutting!
    It is not particularly high density but should work in a pinch. Pink or blue its all the same.
    Or You need to call around to local insulation supply houses. The pink gritty stuff they have is low density foam (2 lb density, I think) and comes in a block as thick as you need by 4'x8' and may indeed not be cheap. It makes an unholy mess when carved. Ask around and perhaps you might get a remnant chunk at one of these custom suppliers.
    Where I live on the coast a much better foam (blue billet) is abundant. Check companies that build for the marine industry. I have gotten some for free.
    Ron