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Discussion in 'Skulls and Skeletons' started by Voltrax, Feb 19, 2012.

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  1. Feb 22, 2012 #21
    Voltrax

    Voltrax New Member

    543
    0
    Poland
    I will try shrews first with maceration and fly larvae.
    Have 2 raw that gradmothers cat killed.
    We will see if that will work!
    Ravenswings,
    I will update everything with pics and I didn't see any dermestidae offer from Europe.
    Even google thinks that beetles from Kentucky are best.
     
  3. Feb 23, 2012 #22
    Voltrax

    Voltrax New Member

    543
    0
    Poland
    OK I'm updating as promised.
    First two pics are start. third is after 20 hours.
    Will rehydrate it today and add some more larvae.
    The other shrew is macerating now. I will look into it tomorrow.
    They won't eat all flesh for sure. I will macerate or hand clean rest.
    If the result will be good enough, I will clean my bat this way.
     

    Attached Files:


  5. Feb 23, 2012 #23
    Guus

    Guus Member

    563
    1
    Norway
    Cool to see your pictures and an interesting attempt. Did you buy these maggots from a bait shop? I wonder if they will eat a lot since they are pupating already in the third pic. I think young small maggots could work out better, they won't do damage as easily and will eat quite some meat. I think it will be very hard to get a nice skeleton out of this, dried and half rotten meat will be very hard to get off the tiny bones, not to mention the slime the maggots leave behind. The bat will be twice as delicate as these shrews and I don't think the maggots will even touch the wings, legs and feet. This size maggot can't get into the skull and the spine will be left uncleaned as well. This is fatty material and should therefore be removed. Nevertheless a good attempt, this is how new techniques are developed and I hope these get cleaner than I expect at this point! Keep us updated!
     
  6. Feb 23, 2012 #24
    Voltrax

    Voltrax New Member

    543
    0
    Poland
    I did get them in fishing shop. We don't have anything like bite shop. there's everything you need in fishing shop.
    As I rehydrated it, they even started to eat flesh from feet's and the carcass is already empty inside.
    You can see that I didn't removed all skin because it's not easy on specimen this size.
    The belly on the third pick is swollen from maggots inside.
    Guus you are correct. They aren't fresh and they are pupating but that OK. My spiders will eat them with taste.
    They didn't even touched tail as there's still fur on it and almost nothing to eat.
    It's just "let's see how it will work" so I don't really care about those shrews. If it was bad idea, I will still have skull.
    Rest of the meat will be macerated or softened in peroxide and removed by tweezers and needle.
    I will update tomorrow morning with new pic.
     
  7. Feb 23, 2012 #25
    Big Country

    Big Country Member

    239
    1
    Pennsylvania
    You need to throw that ruler away. lol
     
  8. Feb 24, 2012 #26
    JRose

    JRose Member

    494
    1
    Idaho
    In the spring and summer I find it worthwhile to flip-over dried-out roadkill carcasses. Have a bottle ready! Often time, even on the oldest, most barren carcasses there are hundreds of dermestid beetles. I'm sure you have them in Poland. I suppose there's a chance you might not, but I'd assume they're all over the world. You can even simply set a carcass out somewhere and let it crisp up, then check it every so often and harvest the beetles from it. It's a decent way to collect if you can't import.
     
  9. Feb 24, 2012 #27
    Voltrax

    Voltrax New Member

    543
    0
    Poland
    JRose I do have some species of Dermestidae family in Poland. they often get into my house. I'm always afraid about my entomology collection.
    It can be a good idea but there are beetles from Silphidae family that will burrow my carcass and I will never find it again. And those ant. They are everywhere!
    Will try your method. Thanks!
     
  10. Feb 24, 2012 #28
    Voltrax

    Voltrax New Member

    543
    0
    Poland
    Time to update.
    As you can see, it's mainly bones and skin now.
    Only places still covered with muscles are head,shoulders and knees.
    Now is the time for carefull maceration. I won't heat it as I don't want it to be super quick.
    Added drop of BactoActive http://www.tropical.com.pl/bactoactive,d229,0,en.html
    I'm using it for my tank with turtle.
    Will update tomorrow if there will be any changes.
     

    Attached Files:

  11. Feb 25, 2012 #29
    JRose

    JRose Member

    494
    1
    Idaho
    If you find a carcass and are avid about collecting several hundred beetles from it, the first thing is to disturb it as little as possible so you don't scare them. They're very skiddish and scram or burrow the second they see you. Very, very slowly begin to submerge the carcass in a tank of water. I have seen over 1,000 beetles/larvae abandon ship from an ancient badger carcass. You have to scoop them from the water quickly or they will drown, but is't a good way to clean sweep. It's tedious, but very worthwhile if you want to expand your colony for free.
     
  12. Feb 26, 2012 #30
    Voltrax

    Voltrax New Member

    543
    0
    Poland
    JRose You could try exhauster for your beetle hunting. It's great for collecting beetles that small.
     
  13. May 17, 2012 #31
    Guus

    Guus Member

    563
    1
    Norway
    Got any updates on this process? I'm curious how they turned out.
     
  14. May 17, 2012 #32
    Voltrax

    Voltrax New Member

    543
    0
    Poland
    Guus. They didn't really turned good. Their skull are like phyllo dough. Transparent. Fly maggots firstly did quite a good job on cleaning meat however they didn't touched the skin with I left as those shrews were mummified. They ate almost all meat, but bones was left unclean and untouched. It was to small even to handle, so I will wait to get some dermestidae for my bat.
    Thanks for interest. I do appreciate this. ;)
     
  15. May 17, 2012 #33
    benjhind

    benjhind New Member

    438
    1
    Ontario, Canada
    I macerated a bat recently out of curiosity, a similar size to yours. The skeleton is indeed very delicate and would be quite difficult to reassemble. I just wanted the skull anyways.
     
  16. May 17, 2012 #34
    Guus

    Guus Member

    563
    1
    Norway
    Ok, too bad. But it is fun to experiment a little. I'll send you a pm.
     
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