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George I Need some Help

Discussion in 'Deer and Gameheads' started by Doug Motgomery, Mar 26, 2012.

  1. Doug Motgomery

    Doug Motgomery Active Member

    I been using water base glue on my ear liners and have good result,but I wanted to try Liquid Fast set so I don't have to babyset them.Well after doing a set of ears, 3 days later they both drum bad, so it must be something I did wrong. This is how I prepped the ears and ear liners,I acedtone off the ears,liner and ruff up the earliners to,Put the glue on the earliners and put them in the ears and adjust them and every thing look great,mounted up the deer put a bag over night,,did my adjustments the next day and 3 days later bad news they had drum on me.So can anybody tell me what happen?
    Doug
     
  2. antlerman

    antlerman NTA Life Member #0118

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    Doug, I haven't had much success with that stuff either. i think the reason why is because we expect it to do the whole job and omit the necessary step of carding. Anymore I just use hide paste and card well and have no issues or baby sitting. Seems the Fast set is hard and dry long before the skin is and the different drying times is why they drum. Besides, I'm not so sure that stuff bonds well to a wet skin.
     

  3. Riverland

    Riverland New Member

    I think the biggest thing that affects drumming anywhere on the animal is proper size of what is under the skin. I use 555 on everything I do from deer heads and ears to African and Asian lifesize and don't have a problem with drumming. If there are air bubbles use a large syringe to draw the air out from under the skin.
     
  4. davehyer

    davehyer New Member

    I have used buckeye supreme, Bryans supreme and roman 555 with no issues. I just rough up ear liner with dremmel, squirt down with laquer thinner put glue on liner and mount. I don't do anything to inside of ear skin. as long as earliner isn't too big you shouldn't have to do anything else.

    I only card the outside edges, i never put anything on to hold the skin down inside the ear.

    I also make sure that i thin down the ear down near the base of the ear. The skin there usually has allot of extra membrane or skin after tanning. I always take off all that extra skin, and I believe it results in less shrinkage so you have less problems with drumming.
     
  5. antlerman

    antlerman NTA Life Member #0118

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    Bill Yox...your carding method isn't neccesary. Why did you teach all of us that?
     
  6. bill@hogheaven

    [email protected] New Member

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    Antlerman...dont forget it.
     
  7. davehyer

    davehyer New Member

    Bill judged one if mounts that was done exactly the way I described He can speak to the results I get if he wishes. Just saying how I do it not the only way it can be done
     
  8. BillFromPa

    BillFromPa Active Member

    Doug, I use epoxy on my earliners all the time. What you have to do is also work the epoxy on the skin. By the time im done prepping the skin the ears are pertty dry. I mix the epoxy and put a skim coat on the liner then put some in the ear itself, work it around real good to get it to completely cover the entire area of skin and then put the liner in. It seems if you just put glue on the liner and slide it in it just isnt enough. I feel the same holds true even with hide paiste.

    I too use the epoxy so I dont have to card or babysit. I use Devcon II which has a 30 minute set time and 2 hour cure time, plenty of time to get the hair patterns worked out. It has no odor and dries crystal clear. On a commercial head I paint the liners pink and thats it. This is a commercial ear with no finish work using the Devcon with a painted earliner. I hav a head on my shop wall mounted 4 years ago with it, it never yellowed and it still looks the same as the day I mounted it.

    [​IMG]
     
  9. Doug Motgomery

    Doug Motgomery Active Member

    That's what I have always used is 555 and had no problems,and I made sure that the skin is not to tight.I have done hundreds of deer with earliners.I just like to try new stuff,and talking to the epo- grip guy this was the magic cure glue for earliners.I can fix the ones I have done. But I just thought I may have done something wrong.Yes Dave I do just like you do word for word but you still have to babyset them I also blow dry them before I put the earliners in. but with epo-grip 10 minits you are done,I would of like to have that option.
     
  10. Doug Motgomery

    Doug Motgomery Active Member

    Well maybe that what I done wrong Bill M,I did not blowdry the ear because the epo guy said I did not have to, even tho the ear was pretty dry.....,and I did not put the glue on the skin side, I put it on the liner.I will have to try this on the next deer I do. Thanks.
    Thank you Tim for the compliment.
     
  11. antlerman

    antlerman NTA Life Member #0118

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    Bill Motzer..thats a nice looking ear. Who did that for you? ;D


    You are welcome Doug. I zapped it caus it seemed Dave wasn't in tune with my humoristic sarcastic ways. Guess he just doesn't know me the way the rest of you guys do. Anyway, have fun kids. It's all good.
     
  12. BillFromPa

    BillFromPa Active Member

    LOL, I know a guy ;) Thanks Bud! Haha
     
  13. Whitetailart

    Whitetailart New Member

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    I know that guy also.

    Nice work Motzer .
     
  14. livbucks

    livbucks Well-Known Member

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    I tried all ways and B.S. Hide paste (Both kinds of "B") just works every time for me. Nothing has given better results. I just card the edges and stick my finger in the ear once a day. I don't like epoxies period.
     
  15. davehyer

    davehyer New Member

    I was not offended. Just telling how I do it. I know there is usually different and. Better ways to do about anything. I'm sure bill has forgot more than i know about mounting deer
     
  16. George

    George The older I get, the better I was.

    Doug, I wash my hide in soap before I begin. I then spin dry I and finish by wrapping the skin side in a towel for half an hour it so. If I have a good ear, I use Liquid Fast Set. If the ear is torn I use Clear Paste. Good ears get 3/4 fluid ounce total poured in and swished around inside to insure complete coverage. An earliner right out of the pack gets inserted and the air and excess glue is moved to the butt. DO NOT ALLOW EXCESS EPOXY TO ACCUMULATE. IF YOU DO, EXCESSIVE HEAT IN CURING WILL SCORCH HAIR AND SKIN. With bad ears, I paint the liners with the paste and work them in carefully. I arrange the tears. In all cases I babysit the ear until it heats up. Then I groom the ear with a baby brush.
     
  17. Doug Motgomery

    Doug Motgomery Active Member

    That seems pretty simple George,I wash the hide in Tide.You would of thought them extra steps I took would have helped me out.Can you see something I could have done wrong? I think I did every thing you did and then some....Now that I think of it,I don't remember it having any heat when it was setting up. O Well I was just trying something new......
     
  18. jorgy

    jorgy Member

    I wipe the inside of the ear with lacquer thinner, blow dry a little, and then ruff up the skin on the inner ear with a wire brush. I use the two part epoxy Matuska sells in the two quart kit, fast set. I never have a drumming issue with it. I just tested some with 555 and had one drum so I went back to epoxy. I use it over celastic and plastic and dont have issues with either. I do wipe the plastic with lacquer also.
     
  19. George

    George The older I get, the better I was.

    Actually, Bullwhacker, I suspect that doing what you advise is exactly what caused Doug's problems. Lacquer thinner, acetone, xylene and MEK are epoxy thinners. If you wash your hide in them, there's the CHANCE that residual quantities of the fluid may not evaporate completely when you use the epoxy. Once the liner is installed, the solvent is further trapped on the backside of the epidermal layer and it degrades and dissolves the epoxy. So instead of curing, the epoxy simply does not cure in those areas and provides no adhesive qualities. Oils in the skin can also do the same thing by insulating the epoxy from adhering to the skin. Soap is the safest way to remove topical oils from the skin without effecting those oils inside the skin. That's the importance of washing and rinsing the hide. Epoxy will adhere through moisture and since the poly ears don't have any mold release on them (poly creates its own release by design and it does not stick to the molds that produce them) you can glue the earliners directly to the skin.
     
  20. Sure to be a rookie question, but I just started using earliners with buckeye paste. I would like to paint my liners natural flesh with life tone lacquer prior to inserting liners. Will that effect my water base paste if paint was properly dry?