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Wrinkles in fish mount any suggestions

Discussion in 'Fish Taxidermy' started by buget, May 1, 2007.

  1. buget

    buget New Member

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    I just finished a Lake Trout and glossed with Envirotex. Now I see a 2" square area behind the gills on the side that has wrinkles. any suggestions on what to? I have to figure out how to get them out. I do alot of fish every year and have never had this happen.
     
  2. TrailsEnd

    TrailsEnd Don't forget the elderly, the young and disabled

    That sounds like a Pescado question to me.

    I wouldn't think there would be much you could do about it. it's surprising the thick enviorotex didn't obliterate the wrinkles. good Luck

    Did you use the spray envirotex or the 50/50 mixture??
     

  3. buget

    buget New Member

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    I used the 50/50 mixture. And the wrinkles showed up after glossing it. I thought maybe doing something like making a cut by the gills and trying to pull them out, then gluing and pinning the hide down, then putting very lightly, then repainting putty. I'm stuck, trying to think of anything that might work.
     
  4. TrailsEnd

    TrailsEnd Don't forget the elderly, the young and disabled

    It sounds like you may be on the right track. I would seem to think that the skin is probably pretty well bonded to the envirotex. I don't know if you would be able to stetch the wrinkles out. I would PM Pescado ( Paul Borkoski) or Rick Krane. Let me know what happens.
    Chuck
     
  5. Pescado

    Pescado Biggest in 2011

    I have never used envirotex as gloss, but have heard it is pretty much permanent when applied. I think your post/topic may have been better titled as Steve B's today.
    What type of hide paste or glue did you use? I'm not sure how the envirotex reacts to heat, but you may be able to get them out that way. A picture would be a big help.

    PB
     
  6. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    I agree, a picture would clarify what's going on. "Wrinkles" to me sound like you didn't have the skin tight to the form. My guess is they were there BEFORE you glossed and the nice shiny gloss is now acentuating them. Again, w/o seeing the pic it's a tough call. But if it is what I think it is, I think the only way to fix it is to grind down the bad area and fill it with Apoxie Sculpt and sculpt in new scales, blend, paint and re-glosss the whole fish. Again though, it's a really hard to guess what's going on w/o a pic...
     
  7. buget

    buget New Member

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    Grinding the area down would mean stripping the whole fish. I dont think theres away to get envirotex off with out ruining the skin, if you can get it off at all.
     
  8. Ron K

    Ron K New Member

    Just how deep are the wrinkles? Could you sand lightly and maybe fill the voids without getting into the paint, like filling in the craters L.O.L. with some clear gloss?
     
  9. buget

    buget New Member

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    Skin is what is wrinkled
     
  10. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    Why would you need to strip the whole fish??? (I'm not familiar with Envirotex gloss, but I can't see why it would be different than any other gloss. You should be able to paint over it if need be) You WILL however have to re-gloss the WHOLE fish to blend things. Ron has the same philosphy as I do. The only way to get those wrinkles out is to sand or grind the area. But unless there's only high spots (highly doubtful), you're going to have thto fill the low spots with something. I've done repairs like this before with good results. Ad, I have no clue what mat'ls were previously used....
     
  11. TrailsEnd

    TrailsEnd Don't forget the elderly, the young and disabled

    buget,
    Go on the back side of the fish where there is envirotex. Take a hair dryer and heat it up. See if you can peel the plastic off the skin. I think that envirotex might become flexible. You will probably have to use a razor or scapel to get it started.
    Chuck
     
  12. oldyellowdog

    oldyellowdog Member

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    Easy fix..... Iron the wrinkles. put a peice of white paper on the fish, and ever so gently, work the iron over the wrinkles, continue lifting the paper and checking the progress. all the while increasing the heat until the job is done. any other questions, call me at 1-801-776-7091 Dan
     
  13. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    Hair dryer is probably okay, but Dan wouldn't an iron melt the gloss into a goo-ey mess? If it's lifted scales, that's one thing. But, if it's truly "wrinkles" then that means there's loose skin there. Therefore, you're going to have high and low spots. Again, hard to say w/o a pic, but I don't think loose skin isn't going to iron out. And I've yet to hear of a gloss that once hardened, you can get off w/o impacting the underlying paint. Even if you could, you'd have a heck of a time blending the gloss where it's "peeled" and where the old gloss meets because there will be a level difference. If you can get by with just sanding the gloss, that would the best because you can fine tune the grit to 220+ and a re-gloss will hide the sanded area. It all depends on the severity of the "wrinkles"...
     
  14. Todd B

    Todd B Active Member

    Marty,
    Envirotex is a 2 part polymer. It is not a regular gloss. I use it to make shallow pours for artificial water scenes. It does make a good gloss but is very thick.

    Todd B
     
  15. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    Todd, I know of the product, but have never used it. I think my whole point was that the problem lies under the gloss - in the skin. Regardless if the gloss can peel away, there still lies an underlying problem - the skin. The skin is going to need to be fixed. The only way I know of to fix depressions and/or bumps in the skin is to either re-hydrate and basically re-do the whole mount. Or, sand or grind the small problem area, level it with epoxy and sculpt in the details. "Wrinkling" would be caused by the skin not being tight to the form for whatever reason(s). Therefore, there's space under that skin that needs to be filled. And the only way to get to it is by sanding or grinding the skin in the bad area(s). Here's where being a good "body man" comes in handy - lol!
     
  16. NOAH@aarrkk

    [email protected] Active Member

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    GA
    Are you seeing the wrinkled skin through the gloss or is the surface of the gloss 'wrinkled' as well? If the surface of the gloss is smooth, could you not paint over the gloss and then re-gloss?

    jerry
     
  17. sparkyf

    sparkyf New Member

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    Good point Jerry, since the envirotex is usually a self leveler. A good artist could probably paint over the envirotex and blend it so you could not notice it, so I guess I'm out of the question for this one!
     
  18. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    Guys, "self-leveling" means the gloss will level out evenly. It will not compensate (thicker or thinner) in spots just because there's a peak or valley in the surface. If the underlying surface is not level, then that uneveness will be transferred to the gloss. The wrinkles may not be as defined/sharp because of the thickness of the gloss, but the "wrinkles" will now be smoother peaks and valley's but they'll still be there...
     
  19. sparkyf

    sparkyf New Member

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    Marty- you obviously havent used this product yet, because it is very thick, and yes, you can take an old piece of wood with gouges in it and in one coat it will be smooth as glass.
     
  20. Pescado

    Pescado Biggest in 2011

    Why anyone would use it to gloss a fish is beyond me.