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So you think if you don't join the NTA, it will dry up?

Discussion in 'The Taxidermy Industry' started by George, Jan 16, 2013.

  1. orry about that, I also forgot the Greast white North, CAN.
  2. EA

    EA Well-Known Member

    George, my apologies. I did miss your post and Mike's. I just saw them. Now I see exactly what you were saying. LOL. I'm a little slow at times.

    It's obvious I don't know Squat about the NTA, how it works or what has gone on over the years. Like I said, it's interesting to learn about. So I offer my useless 2 cents.

    Something that I was curious about, Dennis' mount. Lets hear the story on that one. He traveled far, spent much, shows up with, I imagine a killer mount and is told ?? What, Sorry we can't reach it, you're out ? Is that about right ? How did Dennis assemble it on site or was it one piece?

  3. antlerman

    antlerman NTA Life Member #0118

    If I'm not mistaken....didn't a similar thing happen to Ray Hatfield also??
  4. PA

    PA Well-Known Member

    George - Dumb is in the interpretation. You may think that not joining and paying your $50 will not affect the existence of the NTA but it certainly puts a squeeze on the organization. If no one joins, but instead supports their state association, then the cut of the membership money that the executive owner and sidekick is smaller. I will not pay the membership fee even if the NTA annual meeting was on my way to work until the 10 year contract is done.

    Most of the membership dues is probably only so that the particular person wants to attend the Annual show. If people do not attend the show, then the suppliers don't sell as much supplies, and they take less booths at the next show. I never hear the final count, but I doubt the total mounts entered comes close to some of the larger state show. If a suppier doesn't sell much at a National Show, why would they bother showing up.

    When you analyze the total return of suppliers, when a great company brings the supplies to a state show, say Michigan, the majority of attendees come from Michigan. Since McKenzie and Research, and all the large companies bring the supplies to Michigan, if they sell them all, they make a profit. When an NTA show comes to the southeast (where it always is) only perhaps 50% of the attendees come from within a close driving distance. If an attendee flies to the convention, the likelihood of that attendee purchasing supplies in bulk and driving them home is much slimmer.

    The suppliers do contribute a great deal to the NTA, but membership has a significant impact on the bank account of Membership Services.

    Besides a "World Title" trumps a "National Title" anyday of the week, because the world title has people attending from the entire world, whereas the national title has mostly people from 4 or 5 southeastern states.

    Lifetime members like yourself should insist on a great convention, after all, if you don't attend the meeting, then there is a greater loss in revenue. Also, insist on the NTA magazine being prompt and large. All this costs money, and when it becomes more cost than the reward is worth, they would perhaps not consider it their own personal club and not fight tooth and nail to control it.

    George, go ahead and point out the errors of my thoughts.
  5. Mark V.

    Mark V. Chinook Salmon replica

    Honestly thought the NTA was already gone :) course i'm from one of the parts that don't exist in this supposed national organization :)
  6. George

    George The older I get, the better I was.

    LOL Stephen, I don't see any real "errors" in anything. I do, however, see some faint misconceptions.

    One is the idea of the ED being punished by reduced income. With that current abortion of a "contract", the NTA is committed to pay him and his "staff" their full salaraies, even if they're dismissed up to the 10 year mark of that "contract". The NTA has respectable amounts (or DID HAVE) of money in interest bearing accounts set up by life memberships. Though earmarked (supposedly) no one is sure they haven't been raided to meet that payroll and if not, certainly will have to be eventually if this "contract" is enforceable.

    Two: "A World Champion trumps a National Champion". Though intrinsically true, in fact it doesn't work out that way to the ego involved in this i ndustry. Like the Sprint drivers in NASCAR driving in the Nationwide series or Tiger Woods playing golf in Thailand, or the friggin Rolling Stones going out on the Concert tour with their walkers and false teeth. The WTC has gotten itself in a bit of a jam with NOT awarding "World Championships" at one show but giving the out like breath mints at another one. Name me one taxidermist who would not advertise being a "National Champion", especially if he'd never been able to get a World title. Neither does the WTC offer an "Award of Excellence" or a certification program. And before any of you try to play that down, you need to visit Bubba's shop and see his clientele who're impressed to hell that Bubba has either or both of those things hanging on his wall and in his advertising brochures. Regardless of what you portray Bubba to be, he's still a peer and there's a helluva lot more Bubba's than there are George's. The World Show showcases the very best of the best because the rewards financially are better through a "for profit" venue versus a volunteer 501c(3) organization.

    Simply because the NTA isn't opperated efficiently doesn't mean that the concept isn't pure with intent. Taxidermists are just dumb business people. That's why the National Taxidermists Hall of Fame is a private entity and basically a defunct concept. We have this insatiable desire to eat our own and I'm not so sure that whatever we call it will survive that attitude. Larry Bloomquist is the epitomy of what a good businessman can accomplish with a professionally run concept. It's a damned shame we can't find that in our own public organization.
  7. Skywalker

    Skywalker Well-Known Member

    I for one don't ever want to see the title of National Champion, or North American Champion, ever diminished. However, when the political process overlapped with the competition room it was time for many of us to withdraw for a while. And wait.
  8. Beautifully said!
    And George, the bit about the stones made me laugh my ass off!!!
  9. Derrin

    Derrin New Member

  10. Michael, have seen the few people that go to the business meeting? Lubbock maybe there was 30 people there, same for Huntsville and Springfield IL. And noone brought anything up, NO ONE to include some former board members. The apathy of the membership is what is wrong with the NTA and the USA!

    Yes, its easy for you to throw those words around. Michael wow once again I just shake my head. Why dont you go to a board meeting or general and present your case for being a member?

    It does not do one bit of good to keep bitching here.

    Your chance to bring things to light will be in Baton Rouge LA. what 400 miles from LaGrange?

    I am not trying to start a fight, just stating a point.
  11. michael p.

    michael p. Getting better with age :)

    Because John at every convention now there is a picture of Fred, Harry & I handed to hotel desk clerks and security within the hotel along with some bullshi t story about how we are a threat. I've never threatened a one of them, neither have Fred or Harry, but the Frankie, Crain and Bill seem to be scared of their own shadow these days.

    I'd love to just walk into a meeting and talk John, but I'm not going to jail for these idiots! They really do not mean THAT much to me.

    You really need to learn the facts before you go spouting off at the mouth. This is my only place to view my points. As you know John, Harry Fred and I are BANNED, when we say BANNED, we mean BANNED! So don't talk to me about no [expletive deleted]ing apathy Creagar. Now go sit in the corner and shake your head somemore and keep trying out how to fix what over 20 men and women smarter than you have failed to do.

    Don't wanna be a dick John, but everything you accuse me of NOT doing had already been done and then some. Maybe it's people like you that keep people passive. Talk all this $ hit here and then go to the convention and rub their asses.

    Where are you running for the board of directors?? Where are you standing up in the middle of the meeting. Telling Greg it's time to go...... where are you when you are there?
  12. Michael I said it before the 10 year contract. If you can go back and search the archives its there. I even voted for George cause he said he would stand up.....

    I have not given up, I do have a lot of other things on my plate and I doubt that having two members on the NTA from Arkansas anyone would vote for a third.
  13. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    I've been reading these types of posts for years now and although very, very ignorant on the subject one thing I've concluded is that the current organization is un-fixable. How long has this been going on now? Why would anybody even want to join/build-up an organization that offers nothing and sounds like it is allegedly riddled with corruptness? I've seen it happen in other organized clubs and within sports. The thing to do if you REALLY wish to have a National Organization is to have key members (or ex-members - some folks that have a proven record of getting things done) break off from the existing organization and form a new one. You HAVE to give people a choice. Once potential members SEE value in the new organization they will jump ship. Or at least enough will jump ship to have a big impact on the old organization. Some will survive. Most will not. Suppliers will follow...
  14. antlerman

    antlerman NTA Life Member #0118

    Ever hear of the UTA??
  15. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    Yes I have Tim. But, obviously IF the NTA is still around (and still having alleged issues) then the UTA isn't offering something of value that separates themselves from the NTA. Every organization that I have been involved with that has replaced another has CLEARLY offered some value above and beyond what the old organization did not. Whether that be the services they offered or key members running the show. Granted, this is on a large scale so things may take longer. I just can't see too many organizations surviving with such a bad rep. Especially in this day of I.T. So, I guess the question I have would be "what's in it for me"? Sell me on the UTA Tim. Why would I want to join? What benefits do I get? What is their mission? Why do we need a National organization? These may seem like stupid questions to many. But, realize that I am your average taxidermist!!!! I've heard of the UTA and the NTA. But, that's really about it...
  16. antlerman

    antlerman NTA Life Member #0118

    Whether that be the services they offered or key members running the show.

    Marty, with all things this big, it takes time and MONEY!! The leaders are people who gave up on the NTA and moved forward in a new direction.

    Give them time to build it. Your membership would help in that effort. I do believe the benefits will come for those looking for a personal benefit.
  17. George

    George The older I get, the better I was.

    Marty, just so others aren't confused by this, the UTA was founded by NTA members who'd actually served on the NTA board and who insisted that they build integrity into the organization without lining their own pockets. UTA board members pay their own way with member funds being diverted back to state associations. They've held their first convention and I've heard it went well. I openly discouraged it because I felt (and still do) that you can't reinvent the wheel. One board member was so damned persistent that I thought the board weakened their resolve to keep out of that business, but it is what it is. Their programs still embellish state associations with little or no expectation of returns. I feel some ownership because ideas that I submitted to the NTA and was rejected were implemented in the UTA. There is no big salaried executive director or administrative staff per se so you can rest assured that the bulk of memberships is going to be returned in some way, back to the membership. It's currently the best game in town for a public taxidermy entity.
  18. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    Understood Tim. But, you still didn't answer my question. W.I.I.F.M.? (What's in it for me?) What value does the UTA offer? What am I getting for my contribution? If I'm not mistaken, the UTA has been around for a good half dozen years or so. Assuming that's the same organization that started in Illinois? I honestly didn't even know for sure if they were still around. What does that tell you? And if I didn't frequent this site, I would have never heard of them. Just playing the Devil's Advocate here...
  19. George

    George The older I get, the better I was.

    Marty, you're REALLY confused. You must be thinking of the IGT.
  20. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    Well, I've been MORE confused on other things George - lol!

    Here's the skinny. Not the IGT, but Illinois did indeed have an organization by the exact same (UTA) name that started up about a decade ago. Not Nat'l like I thought though - hence the confusion. I contributed and they fought for Illinois Taxidermist's rights with our DNR. They got a couple of things accomplished, but found out that the DNR had deep pockets and good lawyers. The ILLINOIS UTA disbanded a few years later from what I understand. So, two different organizations with the same name...