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questions about judging

Discussion in 'The Taxidermy Industry' started by ra8point, Feb 10, 2014.

  1. ra8point

    ra8point Member

    As I watch the Olympics, there have been a couple of medals won or lost based upon the score received by subjective judging. The remark was made in one event that based upon who the athlete was gives them a higher grade as compared to someone who might not yet proved themselves at that level. My question to those of you who judge, is the an increase in the score because of level of difficulty or do you tend to score maybe lower because you believe the taxidermist should of done this or that? Also are any of the conventions that have competition keep the identity of the taxidermist a secret where there is only a number to identify who created a certain piece?
  2. Kerby Ross

    Kerby Ross KSU - Class of '83; U.S. Army - Infantry (83-92)

    All ............

    All of the taxidermy competitions that I have been to ...... the mounts are assigned a number with no name attached.

    Now can a judge look at a piece and figure out who mounted it based on quality or certain artistic "stamps" ..... you betcha!



  3. Bill Yox

    Bill Yox Well-Known Member

    Good judges evaluate the work, and use the scoresheet as best as it will allow. Doesnt matter who mounted it. Thats how its supposed to be.
  4. Harry Whitehead

    Harry Whitehead I love to hunt Buffalos!!!!!

    Even though the "buddy system" does exist in competitions, for the most part identity is hidden. I think that judges that judge the piece that is in front of them an not the person that mounted the piece are better judges. What every competitor should expect from a judge at any level should be an UNBIASED judgement of the piece that you have presented...... We all know that is not necessarily what you get every time. To all you bird guys that will be attending the Wisconsin show in a couple of weeks, that is what you will get from me. An unbiased opinion based upon reference. I'm looking forward to seeing everyone there!!!!

    Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire
  5. dartondude

    dartondude New Member

    the one thing mr. yox touched on that can affect the score is the score sheet it's self. not all score sheets are the same.
  6. ElkinsTaxidermy

    ElkinsTaxidermy www.ronelkinstaxidermy.com

    Dartondude----it rarely effects you, since you get all 100s.
  7. Bill Yox

    Bill Yox Well-Known Member

    Heck Harry, tell em what I did in Kentucky last year. I knew it had to be Harrys ocellated turkey we were looking at, but even though I knew it had done well, and Harry and I are friends, I just felt I liked the eider as the best mount for the award we were debating at the time...only to find out later that it was Harrys eider! We were honest, I can tell you that!
  8. Harry Whitehead

    Harry Whitehead I love to hunt Buffalos!!!!!

  9. Doug Motgomery

    Doug Motgomery Active Member

    My question to those of you who judge, is the an increase in the score because of level of difficulty or do you tend to score maybe lower because you believe the taxidermist should of done this or that

    Yes and yes. It should score higher more difficulty it is, such as casting a open mouth but it needs to be done right to get the score that you deserved.
  10. Bill Yox

    Bill Yox Well-Known Member

    Bonus points address the degree of difficulty in most scoresheets.
  11. Same goes for the judges. They are people, they have opinions. You could have 3 judges and end up with 3 different scores.
  12. Doug Motgomery

    Doug Motgomery Active Member

    Boy is that not the truth!!!!!!!
  13. Brian W

    Brian W Well-Known Member

    correct......what one judge looks at might not be a factor with another. IE: In a wall mount fish entry, the back is not supposed to be judged. Marked down one year for the back of a wall mount. Didnt reproduce the scales along the seam or something like that.
    From that point on (only in comp.s), I finished the back side of a wall mount almost as good as the front just in case. Conversely, the year before, a judge told me he never looks at the back side of a wall mount. Hence the subjectivity. You learn as you go but every judge does not see through the same lense in my experience..........so I solved the problem and did a couple ped mounts.. ;D...no question at what sides they'll look at there.......

    Now that we are talking about it and maybe this will help other fish heads in comp, pay attention to EVERY detail you can think off. One year, I learned my "fin attitude" and eye position were wrong. I had a decent mount but had the dorsal too high in the diving position I put it in. I also didn't quite have the eye roll trained on the insects the fish was diving for. Made sense to me after it was pointed out. Subtle mistakes but kept me out of a blue that year ( 89).
    I have found that I have learned so much more from the 4 different judges I've had in the last 7 years, each with the same basic critiques, but with their own twist on it. My goal is just to keep progressing and keep learning. Strive for the next level and have some fun with the Association members along the way. Have learned at lot from the MTA fishheads for sure..........
  14. In most cases at taxidermy competitions judges are chosen and assigned to do a job. The person or persons responsible for choosing the judges in most cases choose the best available for not only judging but also teaching. You do this to help create flow and content to the convention overall.

    The biggest problem I see at competitions is most entrants ( I call them this for a reason ) don't necessarily know how to compete. Now...there are some that are competitors and these guys and gals have learned by trial of fire "HOW" to compete.

    The difference between the two can be as vast as the Grand Canyon or as narrow as crack in the sidewalk. But the process for closing that gap is the same. Learning how to seriously compete. There is more to it than taking the word of a relative or a customer that yours is the best they have ever seen....because let's face it, they probably haven't seen many.

    Always remember. When you enter a piece into competition...you are asking a person to give their evaluation of your work on a certain piece at a given time at that particular event. That's all....Try to learn as much as you can from it and continually move forward.

    Good luck to all this season.
  15. antlerman

    antlerman NTA Life Member #0118

    Judging a mount is subjective. Case in point, I was talking to a judge recently on the phone about a recent competition he judged and how another judge was a competitor. Of course the competitor judge didn't agree with the judging judge. That has to make for a interesting critique, and ensuing debate. Might even become the fire for a long lasting resentment. Often times we don't agree with the judges. We go there thinking we got all the bases covered, but then........up jumps the monkey. Back to reality and striving to make our work better. We learn, we see things we didn't see before and we try to improve. That is, if you understand that judging isn't a perfect science. We open ourselves up to it, but if we are able to also be subjective, we walk away with more than we came with regardless of who you are. I know some who are great competitors that refuse to allow themselves to become subjective. It only works when all are able to understand what being subjective means. If you haven't mastered that, stay home and don't get your feelings hurt. But you'll never win if you do.
  16. Duckslayr

    Duckslayr Active Member

    I would love to see judges use reference to justify their deductions on critiques. It's 2014, no reason to not have an iPad or laptop with pics. I once had a judge tell me he didn't give me a blue because he didn't like the "look" of my eye set. I have no way to know if he was familiar with that particular animal or not.

    Now, let me add this. I'm not a sore loser. I had the mount at a high second as well, but felt the eye set was one of the mounts strongest features, according to my reference pics. The judge either missed or didn't mention some of the mounts other problems, so it all came out in the wash.

    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  17. antlerman

    antlerman NTA Life Member #0118

    Does a score of a 90 mean you got 90% right or 10% wrong? LOL
  18. Brian W

    Brian W Well-Known Member

    Means you got a blue and you say thank you........ ;D.....there is a dark side to the politics involved in judging though, which I have experienced, but probably better suited for a PM........I just roll with it and keep on swinging.........

    and btw Jared, the first 3 judges I had did have Ipads with reference pics to back up their critiques. I believe the last judge I had did also, but I didnt get a chance to talk with him in time..........