Do I NEED to neutralize??

A simple answer would be yes. Every tanning agent I have ever used needed a higher ph than that of the pickle to function (tan) properly. What type pickle & tan are you using?

 

Neutralization is not an optional step. Otherwise, your hide will remain acidic, the hair will fall out, and the skin will remain caustic.

 

You could try a slow neutralization.... Takes 4 hours. Last one I did this way came out perfect. Info is on pro-1's website.


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You do actually check it in a round about way when you adjust the ph on your tanning solution.

 

You check the pH of the skin, not the bath. Pull the skin, give a part of the skin a squeeze to remove excess liquid and fold that part of the skin over the pH paper. I was experiencing hair curling like that also. Slow neutralization was suggested, so that's what I do now.

 

Yes you need to neutralize for tans to bond correctly. Yes you need to check the pH of the skin. No its not acid that curls the hair its likely too fast of a neutralization process, yes slow it down and in increments. Im like 99% sure that youre the guy i spoke to at length about tanning and skipping steps within the last month. Im not sure why youd be asking this after all we went over? I wish you well with your future tanning...

 

Not the direction you want to go. You need to add more soda than required for pH adjustment, check the pH of the hide after the prescribed time and soak longer if need be..

Baking soda is an acid salt. It can act as either an acid or a base under given conditions. We are using it as a base in this situation. It forms a buffer in solution and has a very mild effect on hides..

See also:

http://www.taxidermy.net/forum/index.php/topic,189638.0.html#quickreply

 

Cyclone, any idea why hes still getting that hair curl? We went over many things.

 

I believe the hair curling is related to bacteria damage and not anything to do with the actual tanning process causing the condition. Hair curling seems to always occur on the shoulders and on the sides of the face, and always on one side or the other. Could this be from a deer(dead) laying on its side where it rest on its shoulder and face in either blood or some other contaminate? I worked in a tannery in the past and now on my own, and we have gone at this for years. Salting a hide and getting the moisture content down as quickly as possible, seems to get good results, but does not eliminate it. Putting a hide directly in the pickle without salting seemed to really bring out the issue. I also worked in a shop that used dry preserve on every deer and never once had a hair curl issue, even on questionable hides, so thats something to think about. I just think if its an issue with raising the PH then it would affect the entire cape, pretty much curling the entire cape. Would love to hear some more ideas on this issue. Also, to get the hair to lay down just spray hair with water and take a small chunk of critter clay and rub it with the hair. Brush out when dry and clean residue with windex.

 

I hear ya, theres no consistency yet no "for sure" answer. I have seen what looked like good capes curl upon neutralizing and i think thats the hottest reaction. But i have to admit seeing slippage areas curl too. I just dont know. I can say some cases wont lay even with cabosil/clay treatment.

 

I just plain don't know that one. The first thing would be to distinguish if the burn was actually due to neutralization or if what is being observed is the hairs twisting in the follicles. Twisting in the follicles can be caused by shaving too thin and/or bad spots in the hide to begin with. The entire group of hairs will appear as a "cow lick" and are hard to align like mentioned even when gel or clay is applied. They most often appear, at least when I see them, on the shoulders.

I have also seen hairs curl on the very ends which I would attribute to more of a chemical burn and could even be from dragging. Very few of us check the hides before tanning and probably wouldn't notice these abnormalities anyhow.

Here is my suggestion. First, I'd drain the pickle solution from the hide. Then I'd rinse the remaining pickle from the hide with tap water. Place in a bucket partially full with tap water and then try a slow neutralization, mixing the bicarb in a separate solution then pouring in.

To be frank, I've seen the curl, I occasionally get it but I've never been concerned that it was created by the neutralization step..

 

But what ph? All this talk and no science. I did the ratios suggested, but then found ph is 7 in my bucket and another google search said 4-5?

what do you want the ph to read? Mine says 7…..but internet says 4-5?

 

every formula and step mentions it.

Over the years the pH has been dropped.

I still alum tan, aluminum chloride only locks inabove 4 pH

 

This is like trapping otters and skinning them. All directions on skinning otter say about anything you do will cause them to singe, curling the fur ends. I wonder if it is the same with deer?