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Another question on Rick Krane DVD

Discussion in 'Fish Taxidermy' started by hairy perch, Feb 27, 2017.

  1. Does anyone know which one of Rick Kranes DVDs show him drawing scalwes on a skin mount. I have the rainbow, large mouth bass and the brown trout and remember seeing him drawing scales on one of them and then sealing it. Need to find which one has thet
     
  2. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    Haven't seen the DVD, but if you're talking drawing the outlines of scales then you can use a plain old Bic pen with black ink to do this...
     

  3. Wanting to do it on a steelhead but not sure if I do it before anything esle and then seal it and continue with the painting.
     
  4. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    Good question. I would think that if you drew in scales first before sealing and add your other layers of paint that you'd paint right over all that hard work and lose all that scale detail you just drew in. My thoughts are the scale outlines you're proposing are subtle and therefore would be drawn in last. Very time consuming, but from what I hear it looks killer after all that work. I know DougP has done this years ago with a Bic pen and it worked well. Too much time spent for a commercial mount though. It'll keep you busy for awhile that's for sure! Bic Pen, WC pencils, doesn't matter - whatever works for you. I think the Bic pen would give you a thinner, more consistent line though closer to what I think you're going to want? Versus sharpening a pencil dozens of times throughout the process - JMO!
     
  5. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    Ken, when you tried an ink pen did you have any trouble getting the ink to flow/adhere to the fish? I questioned DougP about this years ago and he stated it wasn't an issue. But I would think it might be difficult to get the ink to stick to the fish? Especially if already sealed or heavy metallics?

    I use pencils a lot too having more of a drawing background vs. painting and I use this technique often on the cheeks of a Black Crappie to enhance or create those black scale edge markings on a replica. I prefer the Derwent WC pencils btw.
     
  6. Maineiac36

    Maineiac36 Active Member

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    the video of the kraneiac drawing in scales can be found in the steelhead reproduction video. excellent video!!
     
  7. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    Ken, sounds like you have not tried one of these cheap Bics? A more expensive pen will have too much flow and cause the barbell effect you speak of. All I can say is when DougP tells me a technique he used that looks awesome, I take notice. Not saying other stuff won't work. But, just for giggles I just now tested a cheap black Bic on the backside of a finished Striper. No flow problems, no problem adhering to a glossed finish, no "barbelling" at all, thin line so no spraying over to blend a fuzzy edge of a pencil and best of all, no reloading = MUCH quicker than any other medium I can think of for this application. Try the Bic, you might like it!
     

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  8. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    It's all good Ken - it just sounded like you hadn't tried these cheaper pens hence the reason I questioned. Not sure how the Bic pen is broader and bolder than a moistened WC pencil but like you said - to each his own! And maybe the effect you're trying to achieve is a bit different than I'm envisioning...
     
  9. Brian W

    Brian W Active Member

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    Well...of course using a silicone scale mold to press in scales into sculpt, smooth, etc. is one way. When you talk about "drawing" scales in though, that same scale mold can do the trick too. I have used a rub-on lightly applied to the mold and press lightly on the fish surface. With practice, you can put down some realistic looking scale copies using your specific fish scale size from the mold you made. Might be worth a try....
     
  10. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    From the way I read things I was under the impression the whole fish was scaled or perhaps a summer run salmon with super thin scales and the poster was looking to "draw in" and enhance all the scales. Not just a patch. I could be wrong...
     
  11. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    Ken lol, actually, what I'm saying is this technique CAN be and has been used with very good results on the show side of the fish too - and skin mounts at that - lol! As long as it's the WHOLE SIDE. Patches would be obvious, obviously (lol). Like I said, great for enhancing the incredibly thin, almost non-existent scales of a summer run salmon combined with scale tips - or instead of. Just a different approach if you want to take the time for a commercial mount to do it. Certainly you've done some of these chromers (or molded them?) that even if you can keep the scales they are still all but non-existent once dried??? This is just another technique one can use in those situations to enhance those scales. Btw, I too have drawn in belly scales on some species and agree this technique works well there too and I too prefer freehand sculpting to blend better vs. molds. So many different approaches and none of them wrong! ;)

    P.S. Probably the best way to describe this technique is "reverse scale tipping". Again, it is not to be used for patches but on the whole show side of the fish. On a summer run salmon you can lay down your silver(s) with an air brush - evenly might I add vs. traditional hand tipping. Then you put in the thin dark scale outlines to might have a place in competition mounts or the higher end commercial mounts. Lotta work from what I understand...
     
  12. Yes guys. It is a rather larges area behind the gill plate and the caudal section I am trying to recreate the scales. Thank you all so much for the great input
     
  13. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    Well, never mind on the technique I described above - that technique is NOT for patches of missing scales as I stated. But, you guys can file my info for future reference if you wanna try it on a whole fish - lol!

    HP, a lot depends on the size of the patch and thickness of the scales. AND, is this for a competition or a commercial mount? That being said, there's several ways you can fix this. And drawing in scales like Rick Krane did on the backside is not one of them! That technique as Ken stated is mostly used for cleaning up the backside a bit if you want, or helping hide missing belly scales, etc. but not really for the show side/patches. PROBABLY the quickest, cleanest way to fix it if the scales aren't that thick - which they're probably not if they're missing, is to simply stamp or scale tip these areas. "Match the hatch" so to speak of whatever color the scale areas are. For this I would consider this more of the blending/prep to paint stage vs the actual painting stage. Repairs are approached with a different mindset in that you're blending to the existing (good) scaled skin. THEN, once you have everything all "even" you proceed to paint it like you see it.

    OR, as mentioned you can try molding some good scales from this fish and go with Brian's method and that will actually give you the most accurate scale definition. But the hard part with this method is laying down the right thickness of epoxy and matching scale sizes correctly and getting them to line up. I prefer sculpting them in myself when going this route on commercial mounts. BUT, for most salmon and trout I think it's much easier to simply stamp/tip scales in the spots needed with paint. For thicker scaled species I would consider making a mold as a more viable method to approach the problem. Again, a lot depends on the size of the area or areas of missing scales, the location of the needed repair, and how thick those original scales are. Replacing large patches of missing scales is one of the harder repairs to pull off IMO IF you're looking for perfection/competition quality. Assuming you're trying to do the best you can with what you got at this point, first I'd try testing an area - stamping/tipping a few "scales" to see if that'll work in your situation. Trust me, it's the quickest, cleanest and easiest to do of the different methods IF you can get away with it. JMO...