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Dog id and ammonia question

Discussion in 'Skulls and Skeletons' started by SpanishGirl, Apr 15, 2018.

  1. SpanishGirl

    SpanishGirl Member

    69
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    Spain
    Hi guys! I know there is so many thread about this, but I just want to know if I can let without supervision a super greasy dog skull into ammonia for a two weeks or so. I had to say this is my first time I degrease any bone.
    Also, my ammonia is 1'75% nothing more added according to the label.
    Here the dog skull pics (found it like that in the field): https://imgur.com/a/QLize
     
  2. Sea Wolf

    Sea Wolf Well-Known Member

    Yes. You can leave it in there for a month with no problems. Can not really tell the breed. Dogs interbreed so much it could be 5 different dogs all in the same animal. A very nice find but a sad one. Someones pet did not come home and was lost. Was there a collar? Or are there many dogs in your area that belong to no one? You might want to recover all the other bones if the skeleton was there and try to assemble it. If bones are missing, you could do this.
    https://www.taxidermy.net/threads/285375/
     

  3. SpanishGirl

    SpanishGirl Member

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    Spain
    Wow this is so fcking awesome!! I wish I had that imagination too…
    And no, I don't think it was a missing pet cause was thrown in a landfill, that make it much more sad, that someone forget their pet like that (if it was ever). By that, there was damaged bones everywhere but im sure isn't complete, so just took the skull.
    I know it's almost impossible to know the breed, but any direction? I think is some kind of brachycephalic male and had brown hair before clean it. Also, by the teeth and porous bone I think was old. What do you say?
     
  4. SpanishGirl

    SpanishGirl Member

    69
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    Spain
    I just have another question... To put or not a lid? Does it matter or just for the odor?
     
  5. Sea Wolf

    Sea Wolf Well-Known Member

    I am thinking something similar to a rottweiler. Below is a picture of an actual rottweiler skull.
    [​IMG]
    I would put some type of lid on the container. You could even use a Zip Loc type of plastic bag there if you have them. Smaller, covered plastic container would work as long as it fit. The skull you have is actually quite clean and will generate little odor if any. The ammonia however is smelly and most people find it offensive. Something strange seems to be happening with pictures on the site now. If you can not see the rottweiler skull, let me know.
     
  6. wontakis

    wontakis New Member

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    Looks like a BBM (bully breed mix). They're the most common types of dog to be abandoned, and the brow bone (and overall skull) is very broad with a thick, short nose and a moderately steep stop. The sagittal crest is quite prominent as well, which is often associated with strong jaws, also a common trait of BBMs. BBMs are often American Bullies, Boxers, American Staffordshire Terriers (not to be confused with the true American Pit Bull Terrier), and Bulldogs. I'm not involved with bully breeds, but I know brown is a common color and their hair is supposed to be short and rough. Rotties, also not my forte, should not have brown hair. They should be a deep black with red markings varying from rich tan to mahogany. I could probably ask some of the bully breed people in my circles, but I'd put my money no doubt on a mix of the breeds I mentioned. I'll put up some photos later when I have the time to go in depth if you want.
     
  7. Sea Wolf

    Sea Wolf Well-Known Member

    A mongrel mix of any of the above could feasibly be any color. More than likely not a purebred of any type. As this is in Spain, doubtful it is a pit bull of any type as they are banned there and you do not own them or import them. Mastiff types are. The bite is good and normal. Not splayed out at all like boxers and many other terrier types. Below is an actual pitbull skull and you will see it is quite different not only at the back of the skull but also the stop, length of muzzle and overall shape. It could be an Alano mix .. but, as with any interbreeding, every dog in the background can contribute a feature. There are many options in what they have there for local dogs. It would be fair to say it is not a pug and weiner dog mix.
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2018
  8. SpanishGirl

    SpanishGirl Member

    69
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    Spain
    All the breed you said are considered PPP (potentially dangerous dogs, see the pics here ) in Spain, so 1. I don't think an owner through their pet like that considering all the paper it has also the supposted love to the pet and 2. it is so unprovable (an impossible, I have never seen anyone) they are street dogs.

    The rottweiler skull is pretty similar, so maybe mine is a rottie mix. Let you the photo when I found him for the hair and the comparation with a female GS mix for size.
    https://imgur.com/a/8UEPx
    I thought the prominent sagittal crest was furthermore for male gender.
     
  9. Sea Wolf

    Sea Wolf Well-Known Member

    How long in length is that skull? It is huge compared to your other one. Could also be a Great Dane mix if you have ever seen any in your area. Chances are, whoever dumped the dead dog there didn't travel very far to do so. Probably a local person from the area. Will be very hard to say it is one thing or another. With the domestic canine, there are too many variables in the common mutt. Pity that they also banned the Akita. The one pictured is the Japanese version and much nicer in temperament than the American type. They can bite but they are protective family dogs and usually have to be provoked. They are very intelligent and loyal dogs. They also just bite. They do not maul, rip, tear and maim like the others do ..
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2018
    Chippers likes this.
  10. SpanishGirl

    SpanishGirl Member

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    Spain
    Looks like Great Dane is much more similar, look the angular process bone! And de small premolars teeth and large canines! It also looks pure breed looking that pic. But attending the sagittal, at the pic looks bigger than my doggy, so maybe I have a female? Mine is around 25cm length, what is pretty similar too with the pic.
    Actually I never seen any Great Dane there, but maybe another village neighbor (or cottage) brought it there... I have no idea, but you saw the photo when I found it, was a lost soul in field.
    About the Akita, it also took my attention and I looked for info: they say it has the teeth facing back, so if they bite you, it is so difficult to freedom you if the dog don't wanna let you go. I don't like considering any dog PPP cause all depends humans, but this is how works in Spain.
     
  11. IMO that dog skull could be from more than a few breeds....or a large mixed breed. It seems to long (and not deep enough) to be a Rottie or any of the "bully breeds". Also doesn't seem to have the nasal "sweep" of a great dane (the more sharply up-curved end of the snout just above the nasal opening as seen from the side - you can sort of see it in the pic that Sea Wolf posted) nor the right muzzle length.
    Size can narrow it down somewhat, but even that's hard. I had a German Shepherd skull (not that I think this really looks like a GS) in my collection that was only about 20cm long (had to have been female) and I have one now that is nearly 30cm long. It is as long as the biggest grey wolf skull I have. Even within breeds sizes can vary quite a bit. I've seen labrador retrievers that barely top 75 pounds and some that were over 130 (and not overweight dogs) ...some is sex difference but also some breeders simply create lines of dogs that are larger (or not so large).
    One breed this skull does sort of remind me of is a Golden Retriever. It is a bit large for typical sizes (more like 22 or maybe 23cm at the most). Goldens have a pronounced stop, a fairly long snout (but not long like greyhounds, wolfhounds, etc) and solid teeth that are straight and fit together well (what is called a "scissors bite").
    Also might be one of the mastiff types that do not have deep jaws and shortened snouts, like some of the livestock guarding breeds. If it was a working dog (and not a pet) that might also explain why the carcass was discarded in a landfill.
     
    SpanishGirl likes this.
  12. SpanishGirl

    SpanishGirl Member

    69
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    Spain
    When I changed two days ago the ammonia it looked completely brown and dirty! So, the skull is dyed into a yellow tone, I think in the next two weeks it will be out (or hope so):
    [​IMG]

    Schrecken Ive never seen a golden retriever skull, googled it but havent enough results to make me sure is the real one... Anyway I have assumed there is an impossible search to know the one real breed. Thank for add this info!
     
  13. Sea Wolf

    Sea Wolf Well-Known Member

    The brown and dirt coming off is a good thing. You might want to soak it some more in clean ammonia if you can get it and it is not too expensive. That way you can tell if more dirt is being removed. It already looks much improved. After another two weeks, rinse well in hot water and let it dry. The yellow tone will lighten quite a bit. You may be happy with the color as is without trying to make it very white with peroxide. With dogs, telling who is what is difficult because of the many breed mixes. It is a very nice canine skull regardless. One you found and cleaned. Not one you purchased.
     
  14. SpanishGirl

    SpanishGirl Member

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    Spain
    I saved the old ammonia, could it be reuse for anything? Although it is not for degrease anymore.
    Yeah, the ammonia I use is cheap, so depender how yellow it will be when I take it out, I'll do another bath or just whitening with peroxide.
     
  15. Sea Wolf

    Sea Wolf Well-Known Member

    For the old ammonia, is there any stone or things outside that could use a cleaning? Scrub and wash off with a hose/water. Walkway/sidewalk?
     
  16. SpanishGirl

    SpanishGirl Member

    69
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    Spain
    Yeah my sidewalk is so dirty cause all the water we use in garden go there and stay... Thanks for the idea!