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Krowtann

Discussion in 'Beginners' started by CK Taxidermy, Mar 13, 2019.

  1. CK Taxidermy

    CK Taxidermy New Member

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    Hi guys, I have been using the krowtann whitetail formula on my whitetails I have an auto tanner don't use any pressure in it. I always seem to have slipping issues mount quick and pay close attention to it and when it dries the hair sets fine but I just don't like having to be so gentle with them. Any ideas to what I am doing wrong?
    Here is my process I rough flesh the cape with a mini flesher then turn the lips eyes and ears flesh around the face but not to much cause I don't want to spend to much time at this so I can get it in the tan. Then I wash it with kemel 4 rinse and put in tanner with the exact amounts on the label. Let turn roughly 24 hours. Then I nuteralize with baking soda. Double what it says to use for the baking soda. Then wash with tide then I spin it out in washer both sides. Then I final flesh with a Dakota v flesher and I spend a lot of time on the face fleshing. While I am spending time on the face it goes in the fridge. Might be in the fridge and out 3-4 days I do some then stop and come back to it and so on. Until I think it is ready to mount. It always seems to pick up moisture in the fridge could that be the issue? Any suggestions would be great. Thanks
     
  2. Dont double the baking soda. Try also just washing the cape in clear water to get the blood out. I dont use Kemel 4 anymore. I do use McKenzies degreaser relaxer.. I think, you are over neutralizing. Reason is I can keep a hide int he fridge for months and month without any problem.
     
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  3. CK Taxidermy

    CK Taxidermy New Member

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    I have recently switch to the sodium bicarbonate and used the proper amount and I did a fox recently but used krowtann 2000 and let it soak in a bucket trying to eliminate my Tanner and same thing happened to it. But I did a bobcat same way by soaking and no prob with it so I just can't figure it out what I'm doing wrong. Is it possible I'm not getting them dry enough before I start messing with them. The spots the slip are nice and white under the hair so to me I feel it tanned good
     
  4. George

    George The older I get, the better I was.

    And you "switched" from WHAT? Oh how I wish I'd paid more attention in 10th grade chemistry.
     
    Dannynewman likes this.
  5. Fallenscale

    Fallenscale Active Member

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    I think over neutralizing as John C said
     
  6. Mike Powell

    Mike Powell Well-Known Member

    You are definitely over-nuetralizing (baking soda is sodium bicarbonate, no difference - which is George’s point, LOL!). But primarily, if I read your post correctly, you are only leaving it in the Krowtan for 24 hours which is only 1/3 the time it needs. Some people do take it out after 24 hours (without neutralizing) and flesh it down and then return it to the Krowtan for another 48 hrs. 72 hours, however, would be the minimum time for tanning with Krowtan. If you’re only leaving it in the solution for 24 hours, and then double neutralizing, the surprise is that you have any hide that is not rotting or slipping.
     
  7. Fallenscale

    Fallenscale Active Member

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    Reason why hide not rotting IMO is he has it rotating for 24 hrs and not just soaking. But I agree more time in tan would be better or fleshing & thinning then returning to tan would be best IMO.
     
    rogerswildlife likes this.
  8. CK Taxidermy

    CK Taxidermy New Member

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    The reason I double the baking soda was because I got on the krowtann instructions and one of the most common asked questions was can I use baking soda instead of sodium bicarbonate and it said yes but use twice the prescribed amount. I thought I was using to much so I bought actual sodium bicarbonate from the supply company and switched to that and used the prescribed amount. But still the same thing. I soak my last fox for 4 days instead of in the tanner Incase that was the problem pulling out once a day mixing and back in. And again I have slipping issues. Not much but a little spot on shoulder. I'm lost on what to do. Really thinking about trying pro Maxx to see if I can get that to work
     

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  9. Fallenscale

    Fallenscale Active Member

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    CK Taxidermy

    What are you neutralizing the capes or hides in???? Are you using your auto tanner?
     
  10. tem

    tem Well-Known Member

    i use the baking soda. i dont double it. havnt had a probplem with it for the last 12 years.
     
    rogerswildlife likes this.
  11. joeym

    joeym Jeannette & Joey @ Dunn's Falls

    I would sandwich the cape between two towels and roll up while in the fridge. This will prevent the moisture issues you are having. 3-4 days is a little long for fridge storage...try to shorten that to 24-36 hours max.
     
  12. Fallenscale

    Fallenscale Active Member

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    But if it already tanned time shouldn't cause slippage? Right / wrong ?
     
  13. rogerswildlife

    rogerswildlife Rogers Wildlife Taxidermy Tommy Rogers

    If its already spoiled before its tanned nothing is gonna save it . They may have not been taken care of before you got them just saying. I've had some iffy capes that krowtann I know saved them .
    Tommy
     
  14. to damn much sodium bicarb. not enough time in the krowtann,

    you need it in the kt 3 days rotate it a couple times a day. then flesh without neutralizing.. now give it another day in the kt.. now on the baking soda it and bicarb are the samething the same strength. use only 1/4 of what you have been.

    Sodium bicarbonate
    Structure
    Vendors
    Drug Info
    Pharmacology
    Literature
    Patents
    Bioactivities
    PubChem CID: 516892
    Chemical Names: SODIUM BICARBONATE; Sodium hydrogen carbonate; 144-55-8; Baking soda; Sodium hydrogencarbonate; Sodium acid carbonate More...
    Molecular Formula: NaHCO3 or CHNaO3
    Molecular Weight: 84.006 g/mol
    InChI Key: UIIMBOGNXHQVGW-UHFFFAOYSA-M

    baking soda.. remember google.
    NaHCO3
    Sodium bicarbonate, also commonly known as baking soda, is commonly seen as a white, fine powder and has the chemical formula NaHCO3. It has one sodium atom, one hydrogen atom, one carbon atom, and three oxygen atoms. It is a very useful chemical that is alkaline in nature.Jan 15, 2016
     
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  15. Fallenscale

    Fallenscale Active Member

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    John C

    My question was not directed to you
     
  16. Mike Powell

    Mike Powell Well-Known Member

    A krowtanned, wet tan cape, if left bagged and refrigerated in a really wet state can still slip. Cape needs to have excess moisture removed before storing in a freezer or fridge. If in a fridge for more than a day or so, I would wrap it in a towel as Joey described.
     
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  17. CK Taxidermy

    CK Taxidermy New Member

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    In a sink
     
  18. DFJ

    DFJ Active Member

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    Wow, another krowtann problem post I thought to my self.
    Throughout the years it's post after post with problems.
    I decided to check out the post and was shocked at what I was reading about the baking soda and sodium bicarbonate issue.
    More shocking was the reply that it was posted to double by the manufacturer.
    I thought it must be an error so I got on the Krowtann site and sure enough thats what was recommended.
    This is completely crazy info that is actually coming from the company?
    As George pointed out, it's 10th grade chemistry!
    No freaking wonder so many people are having problems with it.
    If the company can't even get their product and procedures straight, my recomdation is dump it out and change tanning.
     
    George likes this.
  19. CK Taxidermy

    CK Taxidermy New Member

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    Thanks guys I will try wrapping it in a towel to refrigerate. I really think they are to wett. And my Tanner is an old barrel type with no baffles in it so probably quit using that till I get a different one and start soaking for 4 days so I know I get it tanned for sure. They don't slip bad just small spots here and there. Luckily never on the face or ears. I bet they are to wett in the fridge. Now that I think about it when I work on the them I only work on the face and ears leave the rest bagged until I mount them. The face and ears dry the rest don't.
     
  20. joeym

    joeym Jeannette & Joey @ Dunn's Falls

    Wrong...a wet tanned cape can and will slip.
     
    freeze_1, George and Fallenscale like this.