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Why Are Forms Solid?

Discussion in 'The Taxidermy Industry' started by Clovis Point, Sep 30, 2019.

  1. Clovis Point

    Clovis Point New Member

    So I understand the basic concept of how a form is made. Seems to me like in the center most densest part of the form (right behind the wood) if you had something about the size of a coffee can or milk jug that allowed the inside of the can/jug to be full of air it would save the company’s a lot of money in foam material that would add it over the volume of as many as they produce. Seems like you wouldn’t be in danger of hurting the structural integrity as long as there wade 3” or so of styrofoam between the void and the peremiter of the form.
     
  2. Cory

    Cory Keep an eye on quality!

    For the most part I believe it makes it easier to cut them apart and put them back together; otherwise the cost savings by the company would be put back on you when modifying and it would not modify as easily.
     

  3. Dan Chase put milk cartons in deer forms. Sure made them hard to alter, along with that a buck worth of foam??? Really???
     
  4. Keith

    Keith Well-Known Member

    The couple of Elephants I've worked on were hollow.
     
  5. joeym

    joeym Jeannette & Joey @ Dunn's Falls

    Paper forms were all hollow. You had to cut your own backboard and install it, or pay the exorbitant price of one whole dollar for the company to install it. There once were plastic forms that were hollow. Those were the days that I don't want back! I'll pay the cost of a full urethane foam form and smile!
     
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  6. Clovis Point

    Clovis Point New Member

    But as many forms as the big companies pump out a year?

    Idk.

    Anyway thanks for the input gentleman
     
  7. There use to be a supplier in Jackson Mississippi years ago. Chandlers Taxidermy Supply.
    They did produce a styro manking that was hollow just bellow the head union down. The shoulders had a recessed grove on the back. The backboard was placed in that grove and stappled into place.
    like i said many years ago. My memory may be falling me but back in those days those mankinks was good. Not highly detailed like todays , but made a decent mount.
    I still say from a economic stand point they where ahead of the game. Todays Suppliers maybe could take a play from their book.. Reduce cost and pass that in to us. Yea like that would happen.
    Kinda like, you know my potato chip bag is smaller has less chips. but cost more.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2019
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  8. joeym

    joeym Jeannette & Joey @ Dunn's Falls

    I think that having a hollow core would lead to a lot more defective forms. The suppliers have their method down to an art. Controlling foam can be like herding chickens. Having a bladder in the mold to reduce the amount of foam would possible increase the cost rather than reduce it.
     
    pir^2h likes this.
  9. pir^2h

    pir^2h Retrievers give you the bird

    Years ago I got some bird bodies from John Rinehart (when he owned the company). It didn't happen often but I got some that were hollow inside. I am sure that was not intentional but it was a real pain. I put a wire through it and went to tighten it down and the form collapsed. The did replace them without a hassle but it was still a pain. After that I went back to wrapping my own and for the most part have stuck with that ever since on birds.

    I would think having a hollow spot in the form would lead to very weak forms more prone to breakage especially if it were an elk with those heavy racks.
     
    magicmick likes this.
  10. Heath Cline

    Heath Cline Active Member

    2,335
    11
    Ohio
    There is a way to do this exact thing. And I know for a fact it has been discussed in the past And yes the mannikins would be alot cheaper for taxidermist.
    These would more geared towards the commercial mounts because altering would be tricky. And they would not be made out of foam.
    But also big start up costs to make different molds to make the mannikins this way.
     
  11. Keith

    Keith Well-Known Member

    Hollow forms would get destroyed by shippers. They dent up the solid forms as it is already.
     
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  12. Heath Cline

    Heath Cline Active Member

    2,335
    11
    Ohio
    Keith, it would be hard to damage the mannikins I am talking about because they would not be made out of foam.
     
  13. I dont think shippers are any rougher than they were in the mid 80s during chandlers time. Those forms made it intact. But then again got a box in the other day with the head knocked clean off one. How in the hell is that possible.
     
  14. Micah Howards

    Micah Howards Active Member

    159
    116
    I think if suppliers made them hollow they would still charge the same and they would be the only ones profiting anything.
     
  15. mislynx

    mislynx Member

    80
    12
    32c foam $1.28 hollow
    hollow come on how D word
     
  16. secret code ?
     
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  17. 15pt

    15pt Member

    33
    27
    Alabama
    Sounds like some shit I heard last night!
     
    buckfever* likes this.
  18. Rick Carter

    Rick Carter Administrator

    Hollow wouldn’t save enough foam to be worth the effort. It could easily be done but what you saved in foam would go to added manufacturing liabilities and molding expenses.
     
    magicmick and Keith like this.
  19. George

    George The older I get, the better I was.

    Foam forms would never be able to survive the shippers. Foam is flexible to SOME SMALL degree, but sudden blunt force would crush them like an egg. Additionally, if you were pouring foam like you do ceramic, at some point your foam is going to harden during the process. The foam used today is going to expand within 30 seconds (machine controlled foam it expands on contact of the two chemicals). Still the foam remains soft and supple for a more extended period. Trying to remove it too soon would end up giving you a glove instead of a form. And then what do you attach the antler block and the back board to? I lived through the excelsior/plaster of Paris/clay era, the red rosin paper era, the papier mache era, and the fiberglass era. The first foam forms were a godsend but most times you ended up finding huge voids inside the form because of poor mixing processes. Some suppliers still hand mix and pour but I think most of the big production companies have hot water injected foam which brought OSHA and the EPA into the process and drove costs even higher.

    I keep saying, the forms are free.....if you charge like a professional.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2019
    swampfox2, Rick Carter and magicmick like this.
  20. swampfox2

    swampfox2 Well-Known Member

    George is right - the customer is paying for your materials !