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Woods & Water Questions/issue

Discussion in 'Lifesize Mammals' started by pir^2h, Jan 26, 2020.

  1. pir^2h

    pir^2h Retrievers give you the bird

    I was trying to use some Woods & Water Rich Brown paint today. I bought the paint last summer and today is the first time it was opened (the seal was still in place). The paint was really thick and I could not get it to spray from my Paache H1 airbrush.

    I thought maybe I didn't shake it up good enough. I cleaned the brush,cup and needle then shook the paint vigorously for about two minutes. Still thick. I added lacquer thinner. It still wouldn't spray for crap. What did come out was thinned out and was a "spit" not a steady flow by any means. I added retarder wondering it it was drying at the tip. Same outcome.

    So I tried some Woods & Water pure white. It sort of sprayed but was very difficult to keep it going. If I stopped it was heck getting it to start spraying again. I am not blaming the paint or airbrush as I am myself but I don't know what else to try. Suggestions? Video recommendations?
  2. Tanglewood Taxidermy

    Tanglewood Taxidermy Well-Known Member

    I don't know what the answer to your problem is, however, I wanted to comment on your use of lacquer thinner. If your paint is water based, alcohol, wether denatured or isopropyl works great to thin water based paint. It will dry much faster on the medium than when thinned with water.
    Richs Taxidermy likes this.

  3. FishArt

    FishArt Well-Known Member

    What do the directions say to thin with? W&W paint is one brand where I regularly thin with just water and I don't even need retarder. It does take a fair amount of water. But, that's ok as no need to pay for water and bigger bottles!
    Kerby Ross likes this.
  4. Frank E. Kotula

    Frank E. Kotula master, judge, instructor

    First off adding lacquer thinner to your waterbase paint is incorrect and now you ruined your paint.
    Now being waterbase a drop of water or what I’ve liked is a mix of water and ammonia mixed. Ps be careful on what you add to your paints ( use what’s recommended from the company) as adding different bases to your paint can render it useless as some waterbase paints hate alcohol etc
    Now another problem with waterbase paints is they like to clump your and if their sitting around for long periods of time the pigment settles.
    They should be mixed well, and then strained. I have an article in the fish threads here showing how bad paint can settle. Then as time goes on you will have less and less pigment in your paint and colors will change. This is one other reason I like lacquer as is more friendlier than any waterbase paints JMO
    Lance.G likes this.
  5. Richs Taxidermy

    Richs Taxidermy Well-Known Member

    Yes like Frank said lacquer doesn't mix with water base,been there and I made mud paint,Paul borowski has a post on here about woods and water paint and how to use them ,search his name.
  6. pir^2h

    pir^2h Retrievers give you the bird

    Thanks for the input guys. I used the WASCO thinner for water based paint so I would have thought that should be OK? I only put the thinner in the cup, not the bottle so the paint I got should be good still, just clumpy. I do have some micro fine paint filters so I will try straining it.

    To me water based lifetone paints were not as good (glossy?) the lacquer so I quit using them after a brief trial. I was looking for another paint (safer) than lacquer based but it looks like I will have to go back to them. I will see if I can find your post Frank. Do you know about when you posted it (estimated time frame?)
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2020
  7. Frank E. Kotula

    Frank E. Kotula master, judge, instructor

    No I have no idea but look into dick blick but here’s a link to what I use
  8. Tanglewood Taxidermy

    Tanglewood Taxidermy Well-Known Member

    The thinner recommended for water based paint isn't lacquer thinner.
  9. Mike Powell

    Mike Powell Well-Known Member

    All paints have a shelf life. They will settle, thicken and separate over time. They can usually be brought back to a usable state using the prescribed thinner. As pointed out, adding thinners that counteract with the type of paint being used will worsen the problem. Once you try to use clumpy, un-thinned paint in the airbrush, you will need to clean the airbrush thoroughly before proceeding. I much prefer lacquer base paints. For me, they are easier to use, to thin, and they dry much quicker. IMO
  10. Frank E. Kotula

    Frank E. Kotula master, judge, instructor

    Mike we’ll agree to disagree for waterbase paints becomes useless over time. It doesn’t matter what thinner or base you use as the pigmentations clump up and won’t mix back in. Been there done that with all kinds of waterbase . It’s best to buy in small containers unless you know your going to use them up quickly.
    Agree on lacquer base as the base will evaporate but can be brought back to life with thinners. JMO
  11. pir^2h

    pir^2h Retrievers give you the bird

    This has been a learning experience with water based paints. What I thought I was doing by switching to a water based paint was to protect myself from the fumes of lacquer paints. But after further reading I think this was a false assumption on my part and they may not be any safer. I only bought a couple bottles so I am not out that much. I am going back to lacquer based.
    Lance.G likes this.
  12. Richs Taxidermy

    Richs Taxidermy Well-Known Member

    Neither are healthy to breath but I'm sure water base is the better of the two as far as fumes.
  13. socalmountainman

    socalmountainman Northwestern School of Taxidermy - Class of '73

    Just because they are non-flammable doesn't make them safe to inhale. Also, water based paints do not do well after freezing! If it got that cold in the shop, that may have been the problem.
    I use both W&W and Polytranspar Lacquer because of certain colors unique only to each company. Because I use both I have to make sure I am grabbing the correct wash bottle to rinse out the cups on my airbrushes. I have sprayed lacquer thinner through my Renegade Krome after using W&W - what a mess this makes! It plugs up the gun and I have to take it apart and clean it!
    Done this more than once, too!
    pir^2h likes this.
  14. pir^2h

    pir^2h Retrievers give you the bird

    I am glad you shared that with us, Joe (?) [Is that your name? If notm, Sorry! Wrong person] I had the same issue. At least I know now it isn't just me!

    socalmountainman likes this.