Can We Discuss Paint Mixing And Color Theory?

First off it’s studying the fish and their colors as they are on in the pic you choose to use for reference.
I do both on a fish especially cold water as their greasy and oily. Colors will flow throughout the body yet can be very distinct.
What I try is break down the colors, paint backwards building up colors here and there but in building them I’ll thin them out with gloss or any other transparent medium as I want to see the colors go on slow and build up. There never a straight color that goes on. It’s layers of different shades if that color. then there’s that main color especially on top but there I’ll lay a base down then paint a mixture on top of that to achieve that look. Then where other colors may flow like in the head I’ll be choosing those to work in.
Personally it’s your choice on how you do it as it’s the final outcome that counts. Does it look real ( have depth) or just a painted fish that you think looks good.
Just don’t hold yourself to one method always experiment .

 

I don't think I mix colors in my cup too often, I actually will do what Frank says and layer thin washes of differing colors to achieve the final look I need to have to match my reference. For example on walleyes I will start with super white on the belly and in the mouth and fade it up the side of a fish, I then will go over that with pearl white on the belly fading up and then a gold pearl from the top down fading along the side. Next is the yellows and golds on individual scales and washes of same over those fading out towards belly. Then it's the darker colors like greens, browns, blacks where needed to match references, none of which are applied with opaque coverage. This same approach is how I paint all fish just differing colors.

 

Lighting is critical in my painting, it helps me to see the pigment laying down. I once was told on some colors such as transparent green, "If you see the color, you are applying too much". In my work area 10x12 I have 5 4foot led lights.

 

"If you see the color, you are applying too much".
I sure agree with that, been there, done that.

 

Most of this comes from experience....trial and error. You'll likely find that different paint companies have totally different shades, thickness, etc for the same paint color. There are so many different types of paint and other applications that it will blow your mind!

To make things simple, I merely started off by using many of Rick Kranes videos. It saved me hours of grief! I learn more in a 1/2 hour of viewing than several days trying to do myself!

 

I am trying to achieve more than just a novel understanding of putting down complex and deep coloration, going further than just following a schedule. So far my experiments have not been super successful. I'm going to pose a few specific examples of things that are currently aggravating me, but please feel free to expand on anything within this sphere of knowledge...

When do you mix paint in the jar vs on the media ? for example a candy tequila yellow and kandy kranes gray (which as you know is basically a blue) make a pretty fishy green.... Most folks it seems lay these colors down individually on target... Why didn't you mix them in the jar?

The only colors I have in a bottle are Red, Blue, Yellow, White and Black. I create all my pieces by mixing the primaries and adjusting the hue and saturation with white and black. I use old film canisters to mix my paint. That way I can mix a small amount for each piece I’m making. I also add a bit of blending while painting. Clear is added in layers throughout the process.

I was trying to make a nice transparent very light bass green and follow it up with like a musky green... I tried mixing apple green, transparent leaf green and like a single drop if candy emerald and iridescent green thinking they they would just add some depth and shine.... my end result was ALOT darker and alot more opaque than I imagined it would be...

The amount of pigment in relation to the medium carrier and binders dictates how opaque your paint is. It wouldn’t take much to turn a translucent paint to opaque (color dependent).



when you are trying to change the tint of a color with out affecting the overall value, how do you chose your neutrals? using green as an example again... lets say you have a mossy darkish green that you want to lighten up to more of a bass-y green. Do you add white, light gray, yellow or tan? Like where does the brown-tan spectrum fall into the computations vs black-gray-white? Does brown-tan qualify as a neutral? Instinct tells me that they function like neutrals for some colors but that they are warm. Is this correct? is there a cool counterpart?

What I believe you are hitting at here is the saturation of color and how to effectively change it. Green is a ratio of blue and yellow and to get an earthy saturation of color you add a small amount of red. When you suggest brown it should be understood that brown is a combination of red, yellow and blue. Bring this mix to an extreme and you have black. When you attempt to lighten an earthy green you will be battling with how much red is in the mix. Depending on the amount of red you may not be able to create a lighter green (red is the counter point to green and mixing the two together will muddy up the saturation). Brown is indeed a neutral color and therefore will muddy the saturation as well. Black doesn’t reflect light so is not a color. Adding small amounts of black will change your colors fast, effectively eliminating your saturation but in a cleaner way than brown. White changes the hue of you colors and has a lot to do with the gray scale or lightness and darkness of you color. The yellow and red in your browns will give a warmer adjustment and black or blue will give you a cooler adjustment.

Opacity..... Mixing one drop of opaque black into a translucent color doesn't automatically make the resulting mixture opaque.... but it seems like some opaque colors have the power to REALLY dominate a mixture, like 3 drops of opaque illustration detail yellow can overpower an entire jar of metallic gold ... What rules or instincts do you follow to ensure you are able to obtain your target opacity?

Opacity has to do with the amount of pigment in the paint. It gets a little deep with this one but just understand that each color has its own wave length and when mixing they affect each other in multiple and distinctive ways. Practice with how they affect each other is the only way to understand this.

Like I said, don't feel the need to limit your responses to just these specific questions.... Hopefully at this point you kind of understand where I am at in my understanding of colors on my path, so anything remotely relevant you'd like to share will be gratefully received.


Well, hopefully some of this was helpful. Color is a fascinating thing and I find that mixing and understanding how to create my colors is very satisfying. Oh and yes for the most part I do pre-mix my colors and keep them in the small film canisters. Best of luck with your studies.



-Pete

 

Pete, not even gonna attempt to compare my painting ability to yours but does the way you paint cold water fish differ from warm water fish? I do mainly warm water fish, very seldom do I get the chance to paint cold water fish. I am always trying to better myself and abilities, so this is an honest, trying to learn question.

 

For me yes I would approach painting a warm water fish just as I would a cold water fish. The color theory remains the same regardless of what the subject is that I would be painting. Keep in mind that pre-mixed paints make things simpler and speeds up the process of painting fish (for most people). Once you start mixing colors these pre-mixed paints can be a hindrance though (hard to tell exactly what colors are used). I was trying to offer some insight into mixing your own paint and how colors work off each other. Sounded like that was what Clovis was after.

 

Thank you, by reading your reply to Clovis, I learned or relearned something I had forgotten. Art class was a long time ago.

 

Very informative, thanks

 

Pete, this is exactly the type of response I was hoping to get... informed discussion on the theory behind what were doing (and why I still hang out on taxi.net as opposed to migrating to FB groups... its a quality for convenience trade off)...

anyway
The amount of pigment in relation to the medium carrier and binders dictates how opaque your paint is. It wouldn’t take much to turn a translucent paint to opaque (color dependent).
Did you say this backwards? i can understand how you could make an opaque translucent, but cannot see how the opposite could be achieved without changing atleast the shade if not the hue.


So how a translucent paint works is its ability to let light in as well as reflect the color back to the viewer. An opaque paint doesn’t let light in and for the most part only reflects the color back to the viewer. So hue is the dominant wavelength of the color you see and depending on the color you mix, with it, can alter the perception of that color dramatically. This in turn effects the ability of light and refraction in the translucent paint. Translucent paint can be achieved in multiple ways with the ratio of medium carrier, binders and the pigment. You mess with that formula and you can lose the translucency (if the added color is opposing). If you try to make a translucent paint from an opaque paint you will be adding a compatible clear paint so you don’t degrade the binders in the paint. I mentioned color dependent because I was talking about the change you can get in value and hue, so yes that would change. If you’re adding the exact same color and I believe this is what you are thinking then it would simply take more amount to lose the translucency. However Blue and black generally takes less paint to achieve opacity.

Your last response about opacity and interaction is really getting at kind of the essence of one of the things that really puzzle me the most concerning painting.... thats why im asking ... better informed experience makes experience more effective. Learning fundamental knowledge and building upon the work of others can eliminate many of the trial and errors and teach us what too look for. for example, I am learning to look at each color in seperate ways based on whether they are altering hue (yel mixing with blu to make grn) or more altering the tone (yel mixing with reddish orange to make more orange-isn orange).


Hue is the purity of your pigment and tone has more to do with the saturation of color and the gray scale. I suggest looking at color by understanding that all that you see is derived from the primary colors. If you look at it this way it should give you a better understanding of what happens when you mix them. Then add in the understanding of what happens when you add white (all color) and black (no color). For example let’s consider an earth toned green. To start off we know there is yellow and blue mixed. Now why would it have this warm earth tone to it? We know there is red, white and black left so how do these effect the color. Red added to green will turn it brown and that would be a good start but then it still looks like it needs to be more muted or maybe chalkier. I would then try a small amount of white. Maybe that got you closer but started to look a bit too light so then I add a bit of black or more likely blue. You keep on experimenting this way and that’s what brings you understanding. You want to do this in small amounts or you will shoot right past what you want.


Another question posed for the sake of taxidermist applications: can you thin a color too much? I know sometimes if im a little heavy handed with the cut i can have paint run on target, but with careful and proper application can you ever really be too thin? or maybe the better eay to ask is, "is there any time when you dont want to thin your paint?" other than maybe like with an all white base/primer coat or an all over pearl type effect maybe


First off there are many paints available to us and they are generally unique to each company. So a person needs to experiment with the paints they have so see how far they can be stretched and still hold their durability. Most are made up from pigment, medium carrier, binders and dryers. They can be thinned too far degrading the durability of the paint. I have found a small work around with this though. I layer my painting with clear effectively locking in the paint then continuing on from there. I’m also able to add depth with this process. With that said, some paints can be thinned very far like water colors. Just need to practice with what you use. Oh and I don’t always thin my paints as I’m most proficient at hand painting and this is all so relevant to how you paint.



-Pete

 

Pete,
Thank you for posting this up! I haven't posted a fish on here for a long time but I do drop in from time to time. This is exactly the quality information I look for on here.
I don't do much taxidermy work any more but this information is still stimulating and keeps me interested in getting back to it.

 

JHardman, I’m glad you’ve found this interesting. Color and how it works is fascinating to me.

 

My instructor sent me to the automotive paint store to purchase a quart of white, black, silver metallic, red and yellow paint. He said, "these are all the colors you will ever need". By the time I graduated from the course he painted a walleye, lake trout, several rainbow trout, perch, bluegill and a largemouth bass which I had mounted. There was no mixing involved. He just sprayed the colors over each other until he reached the desired color. It may sound heavy handed, but it wasn't. These colors were opaque where they needed to be and transparent where they needed to be. To pass the class I had to paint a rainbow trout. He made those cans of paint look like they had magic in them. It's amazing what you can do with paint once you know how to use them. Learning how to blend paint and testing your own limits can be just as awarding as mounting any fish. The skies the limit.

 

Indeed many don’t know black and yellow make green lol

 

That would be correct most of the time Frank but, not always.
My guess would be that most people don’t understand why you generally get green when you add yellow to black or know why it doesn’t turn green with some blacks.